Do you think President Bush and his administration are doiing their best?

POSTED BY: chrisisall
UPDATED: Monday, June 13, 2005 15:48
VIEWED: 4643
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CHRISISALL

Thursday, June 9, 2005 9:07 PM

Do you think that The present administration is doing what they believe to tb the correct things regarding the war in Iraq? I mean, nobody believes they are out to do harm, right? In the larger picture, they mean to stabilize the region, and stem the flow of terrorism, right?
Saddam was a jerk, we can all agree on that. Isn't it that some of us disagree with the methods, or the particular decisions regarding what actually needs to be done as opposed to what doesn't?
Some parents tell their kids getting a shot won't hurt, knowing full well that it will, and decide this is best for the child.
The whole WND thing was surely a lie (or exaggeration, at best), but wasn't it all for the right thing, at least in the minds of our leaders?
I make fun some, but I'm really interested to find out how people feel on this. Maybe President Bush and co. feel and truly believe that an imperialistic (in a good way) America with qualified and limited civil rights is the way to go for our economic and physical saftey and security in the future.
I'd like to think that so many dead and wounded to achieve such limited success was not their goal, after all.
Center or Edge, I value your thoughts.

Uncharacteristically serious Chrisisall

SIGNYM

Thursday, June 9, 2005 9:26 PM

I believe- and I hope I don't set off a firestorm - that Bush, Cheney, Rumsfeld, Rove, Rice, et al have an agenda in mind that has nothing to do with the good of average Americans. I believe they look at us as nothing more than commodities, and have no qualms pillaging the country. In 1996, Rumsfeld was selling nuclear technology to N Korea as a Board member of ABB. Two years later, he was asking for money to contain the threat. How cynical is that? This is just one example, and nothing has changed in the interim.

www.dissidentvoice.org/Articles2/Reed_Rumsfeld-NKoreaNukes.htm

GINOBIFFARONI

Thursday, June 9, 2005 10:18 PM

That would depend as to what one would understand their goals to be,

" In the larger picture, they mean to stabilize the region, and stem the flow of terrorism, right? "

If this was their goal, I would call the past two years a huge failure, the stability of the area is very questionable at the moment with possible expansion of the conflict into Syria, and Iran. In addition, other countries in the area Saudi Arabia, Yemen, Pakistan, Uzbekistan among others are increasing in anti US opinion, and the stability of those governments are becoming more questionable. When King Fahd dies, succession could be a big mess. In addition, the governments the US has chosen to ally themselves with conduct themselves with ideals which are contrary to the " stated American values " This has had the effect of driving recruitment for so called terrorist groups. When the Uzbek government cracks down on its population the backlash goes against their government first, then to the US for supporting that government. Hypocritical speechs about promoting freedom, while backing tyrannts has been the orgin of much of the anti-american thought.

" Saddam was a jerk, we can all agree on that. Isn't it that some of us disagree with the methods, or the particular decisions regarding what actually needs to be done as opposed to what doesn't? "

This was the case when the alliance was formed during the first Gulf War and the reason the war stopped at restoring the Emir of Kuwait. It wasn't that anyone in Europe or the middle east liked or wanted Saddam, they just didn't feel a US handpicked " Shah " of Iraq was a better situation. That scenario is much the same now, while there has been an election there, control of who ran, as well as much of the policy that government is allowed to make is questionable, and since the US installed the government which signed longterm Military basing deals, as well as handed out big long term deals to US oil interests, and future government is going to be handcuffed to US policy. The reason there appears to be a lack of exit strategy, is because there is none, you will be there for a very long time to come ( unless like Vietnam or Lebanon or Somalia , you pull out)

I am much more cynical, by using Iraq to control Saudi Arabia ( if civil war throws out the house of Saud, they would need a nearby force to intervene ) threaten and eventually take over Iran ( likely using WMD and terrorism as a reason once again ) the US can control the export of Middle-east oil. By controling Afganistan, the US will soon build pipelines from the former Southern Soviet Republics and the Caspian sea. If one believes Chavez, South American oil will be targeted soon as well.

I don't see control over oil as an end objective, by by controlling exports from these countrys they do have a club to use against the developing economic superpowers of India and China, as well as the EU if they ever get their act together. I know the US preachs open markets and free trade, but being from Canada I would have to point out they only seem to want " free trade " on their own terms, and they are willing to break deals whenever it is to their own advantage.

" but wasn't it all for the right thing, at least in the minds of our leaders? "

That is irrelavant, I mean even Hitler thought his actions were for the greater good of Germany. It is the opinion first of all of the population of the US that has to decide whether this course is right for your country, and then the rest of the planet that will have to decide how to react to what you do next.

" Looking for a place to happen
Making stops along the way "

CHRISISALL

Thursday, June 9, 2005 10:47 PM

SignyM, I personally tend to have a very 'They Live' way of seeing those in power, I just wanted to explore the possibility that maybe, in thier own twisted way, our and other leaders are trying to abide by the laws of the jungle, while still trying to make this world the 'best possible' jungle it can be.

I may just be trying to make lemonade out of artechokes...

Good to question your view, sometimes, though Chrisisall

CHRISISALL

Thursday, June 9, 2005 11:00 PM

Thanks for the post, GinoBiffaroni, views from outside the US usually seem a bit more balanced and informed, soundbites (ie: WMD, Saddam A World Threat) tend to rule in this country, IMHO.

More Americans get thier news from blagh blagh blagh Chrisisall

RICKKER

Friday, June 10, 2005 4:47 AM

OK heres my two cents.
Back in 2000 I believed Bush to be the worst person to get the job. During the election I remember a news man in Florida talking about how things were going, including a member of the Sherrif's department being two hours late delivering his designated ballat box. Then for four years I listened to him constantly say one thing and do the exact opposite(create jobs in America anyone?) Anyone remember his ratings before 9/11? After it was like he could do no wrong, by doing absolutely nothing right. The only reason he went int Afganastan was because the Taliban were the ones behind the attacks. If we wanted to show the middle-east that democracy was a good thing why not start it there. Why Iraq? OIL! Good old fashion greed. The Bush administration wanted to get their hands on the worlds largest oil reserve. Bush and Cheney have been blatant in their money grabbing and the people love them for it. The vice president's company wins a billion dollar contract to rebuild Iraq and nobody bats an eyelash. They take all the money do no work and tell us they need billions more to get it done? You honestly believe Cheney isn't getting a kickback? You honestly think Bushes oil buddys havent been hauling oil out since day 1? And the price of gas? Shure Saddam was an ass. All those poor Iraqi people he was slautering? Weren't they Muslum Extremist trying to turn Iraq into a muslum state like Iran? Who was responcible for 9/11? Oh yea Muslum Extremist. My two biggest problems with Bush.
1: he is so ready to goto war now but when it was his turn to serve where was he?
2: to create jobs for Americans he gives corporations tax breaks to send jobs overseas?
Money is not the root of all evil. The love of money is. Bush LOVES his money. He thinks it is so important that he believes only a select few whould handle it. Tax cuts for the rich, Tax cuts to corporations to send jobs overseas. All he had to say was tax cuts to keep jobs here and I would have kept some respect for the man.
I have heard that a lot of republicans are mad at George Lucas because they believe he made the emperor and his people seem to be "Bush like."
Well, let me see if I got this right. George had this planned since the 1970s and now you think that the bad guys are modeled after your "hero". Maybe you need to do a little soul searching, maybe you can find the guy Bush and Cheney sold theirs to.

SERGEANTX

Friday, June 10, 2005 5:46 AM

So... are you saying that the George Lucas should sue the PNAC for plagiarism?

SergeantX

"Dream a little dream or you can live a little dream. I'd rather live it, cause dreamers always chase but never get it." Aesop Rock

SIMONWHO

Friday, June 10, 2005 2:44 PM

I think there's a quote from Fry & Laurie that sums my view on the question best:

"Yeah, I think Virginia Bottomley's doing the best job she can. Just a pity that it's crap."

GEEZER

Friday, June 10, 2005 3:04 PM

Quote:
Originally posted by SignyM:
I believe- and I hope I don't set off a firestorm - that Bush, Cheney, Rumsfeld, Rove, Rice, et al have an agenda in mind that has nothing to do with the good of average Americans. I believe they look at us as nothing more than commodities, and have no qualms pillaging the country. In 1996, Rumsfeld was selling nuclear technology to N Korea as a Board member of ABB. Two years later, he was asking for money to contain the threat. How cynical is that? This is just one example, and nothing has changed in the interim.

www.dissidentvoice.org/Articles2/Reed_Rumsfeld-NKoreaNukes.htm

Might be more believable if your link article wasn't so obviously biased as to make even Fox News actually look "Fair and Balanced" in comparison.

But I'd really like to know what this "agenda" that you keep talking about consists of; in a bit more detail than 'it's the oil', or 'pillaging the country'.

"Keep the Shiny side up"

REAVERMADNESS

Friday, June 10, 2005 3:21 PM

I think they are doing their best.

Think about that for a minute.

When I die I want to go peacefully in my sleep like my grandpa. Not screaming and yelling like everyone else in the car he was driving.

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