Weapons and Tech in the Verse

POSTED BY: caul
UPDATED: Wednesday, May 18, 2005 02:04
VIEWED: 16919
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ANTHONYT

Monday, May 16, 2005 3:48 PM

Hello Rocket,

"Although that still doesn't explain how the "It spins and you move" nature of Serenity's engines work."

The spinning drive element definitely seems to be related to Serenity's speed. If I remember it spins pretty fast when they're going to do a 'full burn.'

I conjecture that the spinning drive is a part of the fusion drive system, and that when it doesn't spin they can't get a fusion reaction going. Thus no thrust. Thus, even though you might be moving, you're not moving where you want to go. No course corrections. If you happen to be currently aimed at the far reaches of the black... then you'd just float off into nowhere eventually.

Or so I conjecture.

Serenity seemed to be motionless in Out of Gas, but there was no frame of reference. Everything in space is relative to everything else.

--Anthony

"Liberty must not be purchased at the cost of Humanity." --Captain Robert Henner

BLEYDDYN

Monday, May 16, 2005 4:30 PM

Quote:
Originally posted by viggenboy:
I don't remember ever seeing catriges eject, but its probably something I've missed versus them not being there. If in fact the weapons are not discharging shells, then there's an argument for the type of caseless rounds used in Aliens by the space marines.

Huh. Can't believe I've never noticed the lack of cartridges being ejected. Do they ever show anyone loading rounds into a weapon other than the grenade sized one that Jayne loads in the pilot? Have to watch a few episodes again

However, you don't have to go to a Sci-Fi place to find caseless rounds. Heckler & Koch made an infantry rifle that used just such a technology. See here, for example: http://www.military.com/soldiertech/0,14632,Soldiertech_G11,,00.html

While the G11 seems to use a fairly conventional primer, it should be easy enough to switch to some kind of electrical ignition.

On the other hand, I always liked Babylon 5's PPG's which supposedly fired plasma created by hitting water (or something similar) with a very high voltage, then accelerating it magnetically. Theoretically, you should be able to combine the two by using the expanding plasma to fire a solid projectile.

--Bleyddyn

ANTHONYT

Monday, May 16, 2005 4:37 PM

Hello,

I've always been fascinated by the phrase "She needs air around her to fire" that Jayne says in regards to Vera.

Real guns have all the air they need inside the cartridge. This lends additional support to the idea that these slugs use a different propulsion mechanism. Air specific, even.

I wonder what it could be?

--Anthony

"Liberty must not be purchased at the cost of Humanity." --Captain Robert Henner

DEADMAN

Monday, May 16, 2005 7:34 PM

Anthony, its been suggested somewhere, I think in the firefly wiki, the the guns use some kind of chemical (organic?) based propulshion system as opposed to a purely explosive one. How modern rounds ARENT chemical is beyond me, but there it is. Maybe firefly guns are more guass based? Rail guns wouldn't require air so that throws that theory out.

Gravity drive and FTL:
Ok, lets pretend for a minute that we have multiple star-systems, FTL, and all that other good stuff.

Again, why would serenity need some kind of seperate invisible drive? Whenever she goes to warp or lightspeed, or whatever, the engine that provides the power for that is clearly the big firefly effect that comes off her back. Heck, practically the back third of the craft is a giant engine. Why would you want ANOTHER one on top of that? Think of it this way: however serenity tweaks space to achive FTL, that drive system is probably a part of the big main drive off the back. In fact, I would propose that ALL of serenity's engines feed off her main engine, becuase otherwise in out of gas there would be no reason for serenity to be dead in the water as long as they could keep her two side engines going. Modern Jets are powered by their engines, so there's no reason serenity couldn't be too as long as she had fuel.

The biggest question about serenity's artifical gravity is why it kept functioning after all her other systems were down...you still need power in some way for that. Which leads to...

As for the spinny thing: I always figured it had more to do with power generation, or was some important part of the main engine. The fact that the main engine always turns at about the same speed as the spinny thing would seem to suggest that.

Terraforming is actually NOT in the relm of science fiction. We could, at this moment, turn mars into a habitable planet WITHIN 80 YEARS. Basically, it would involve placing solar reflectors in orbit to melt the icecaps (which would actually thicken the atmosphere believe it or not, and introducing lichen to turn the soil into something useable. Of course, mars actually has almost earth normal gravity, roughly the same amount of sun energy earth does, a lot of water, and an already existant if thin atmosphere.

The biggest scientific problem with a giant single solar system as I see it is that all the outer worlds would get very little light, especially if we're talking about a huge planet cluster here which would necessitate larger orbits for a number of planets to keep them all from tripping over each other's gravity wells. Pluto and cheron are little iceballs. However, on the subject of moons, because of jupiter's enourmase size, it would be entirely possible for it to have an earth sized moon orbiting around it. As I recall its moons (titan for example) are actually significantly larger than earth's moon.

"Also? I can kill you with my brain."
-River

ANTHONYT

Tuesday, May 17, 2005 6:36 AM

Hello,

Keep in mind that Serenity's life support is not entirely dependant on the big engine.

When Mal asked about the backup life support in out of gas, he clearly expected it to work independant of the main system.

But Kaylee said it wasn't even on, that it must have been damaged in the fire.

So, I would conjecture that Serenity was operating from some kind of battery power. They couldn't change course. The life support was disabled in the explosion. But lights, communications, and gravity still worked.

--Anthony

"Liberty must not be purchased at the cost of Humanity." --Captain Robert Henner

GUNRUNNER

Tuesday, May 17, 2005 7:41 AM

I think that the whole “Can’t fire guns in space” thing is a regulation issue and not a technical issue. The Alliance wants to prevent people from arming ships with weapons so they force all gun manufactures to make rounds that can’t fire in space. So you could buy a gun that could give an Alliance Gunship a hard time but finding rounds for it would be hard and building an aiming system with a built in case & air supply would be beyond the resources of an average criminal.

EV Nova Firefly mod Message Board:
http://s4.invisionfree.com/GunRunner/index.php?act=idx
My Other Site:
http://www.utnhq.com/TLAM_Strike/index.htm

DEADMAN

Tuesday, May 17, 2005 10:19 AM

"Bullets are soft lead Mal. Even Vera could barely breach the hull...and she's the best I got."

I doubt handguns could do anything significant to alliance ships. ESPECIALLY a big ole' cruiser like the dortmunder. You'd need missles to deal with something like that.

"Also? I can kill you with my brain."
-River

ANTHONYT

Tuesday, May 17, 2005 4:08 PM

Quote:
Originally posted by GunRunner:
I think that the whole “Can’t fire guns in space” thing is a regulation issue and not a technical issue. The Alliance wants to prevent people from arming ships with weapons so they force all gun manufactures to make rounds that can’t fire in space. So you could buy a gun that could give an Alliance Gunship a hard time but finding rounds for it would be hard and building an aiming system with a built in case & air supply would be beyond the resources of an average criminal.

EV Nova Firefly mod Message Board:
http://s4.invisionfree.com/GunRunner/index.php?act=idx
My Other Site:
http://www.utnhq.com/TLAM_Strike/index.htm

Yeah, I can't say I buy the regulation theory, especially given that many of the guns and ammo are likely to be manufactured locally on rim worlds who are only peripherally under the Alliance's radar.

And really, the Firefly crew seems unlikely to care about such laws. When is the last time they had their ammo checked?

--Anthony

"Liberty must not be purchased at the cost of Humanity." --Captain Robert Henner

GUNRUNNER

Tuesday, May 17, 2005 6:17 PM

Quote:
Originally posted by Deadman:
"Bullets are soft lead Mal. Even Vera could barely breach the hull...and she's the best I got."

I doubt handguns could do anything significant to alliance ships. ESPECIALLY a big ole' cruiser like the dortmunder. You'd need missles to deal with something like that.

"Also? I can kill you with my brain."
-River

Well Jayne was thinking about shooting from inside the ship at the walls, shooting at another ship is different. You have an Alliance Gunship flying towards you’re bow at equal speed as your ship, you fire a burst from a large machine gun- the speed at which the bullets hit the Gunship is double, increasing armor penetration. Now take a stern on attack for example, it would be just the bullet’s speed plus targets speed but that is still at speeds greater than a normal gunshot. Firing from inside the ship you have to deal with the ship’s artificial gravity and inertial dampening.

Of course I wouldn’t expect Jayne to know that.

EV Nova Firefly mod Message Board:
http://s4.invisionfree.com/GunRunner/index.php?act=idx
My Other Site:
http://www.utnhq.com/TLAM_Strike/index.htm

CLJOHNSTON108

Wednesday, May 18, 2005 2:04 AM

Quote:
Originally posted by Bleyddyn:
I always liked Babylon 5's PPG's which supposedly fired plasma created by hitting water (or something similar) with a very high voltage, then accelerating it magnetically.

During the gun battle in "Safe", I believe I detected a bit of the PPG sound effect...

http://faultgame.com/images/ppg.wav

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