Voiceover or not? and IS Deckard a replicant?
POSTED BY: chrisisall
UPDATED: Sunday, June 25, 2006 23:07
VIEWED: 9338
PAGE 3 of 7
A replicant? In the words of El Pablo Gonzalez, "No way, Hosea." But that's not the point, after all, is it?
Nope. The point is that the movie, and Philip K. Dick's novel "Do Androids Dream of Electric Sheep?" leave that question open for the viewer and the reader to decide. For me, there are too many elements that point to Deckard's humanity. Also, if they want an effective Blade Runner, they could have added all sorts of cyber gizmos for his work without the need to resort to computers. Sorry to disappoint you folks, but face it. Deckard's a human.
To qoute an essay on the subject. "By raising this issue, the reader is drawn further into Dick's science-fiction universe where reality is never what it seems and there are infinite possibilities for any situation."
Oh, and just to ruffle your feathers a little more, the voice-over is better than the movie without it.
"Keep Ted Turner and his goddamned Crayolas away from my movie."—Orson Wells
NOTIFY: Y | REPLY | REPLY WITH QUOTE | PERMALINK | TOP | HOME
Funny, I just picked up this DVD a week ago and watched it again. A truly amazing movie.
In my opinion the interesting question is not whether Decker is a replicant, but why the question is introduced in the first place. When I first saw the movie, I thought it was a just a Hitchcock-like twist to add to the mystique or somesuch. Now, I'm seeing it a bit differently.
What struck me in re-watching, was just how sympathetic the androids are. In my opinion the point of raising the Decker/replicant question is to highlight the central metaphor of the movie which is, not that the replicants are very much like us, but that we are the replicants - lost, desperate creatures frustrated by the knowledge of our own mortality.
"...all those moments will be lost in time, like tears in rain."
And don't even get me started on the religious symbolism....
Oh... and the director's cut is much better.
SergeantX
"Dream a little dream or you can live a little dream. I'd rather live it, cause dreamers always chase but never get it." Aesop Rock
NOTIFY: Y | REPLY | REPLY WITH QUOTE | PERMALINK | TOP | HOME
Zoid, several excellent points! I must think on this more...
One last thing to consider(or explain to me), near the end Roy says, directly to Deckard: "I've seen things you people wouldn't believe..."
I've assumed that by "you people" he was referring to non-replicants of which Decard was one, and when he said "Ah, kinship" he was referring to Deckard's determination or will to live being similar to Roy's own in this moment so close to what could be both their ends.
Your powers of reason are impecable. Mr. Holms has nothing on you.
The now wondering if he's wrong Chrisisall
NOTIFY: Y | REPLY | REPLY WITH QUOTE | PERMALINK | TOP | HOME
Zoid, I somehow accessed your other post, the one that didn't make it here, wierd, huh?
I don't know if you got my reply, so I'll do it over, with more.
Excellent points you made!! I'm not playing devil's ad, I've truly been on the fence about this for years. All the comments on this thread(especially yours) are gettin' me leanin' toward his bein' a rep. One last thing I'd like a comment on if you'd oblige;
When Roy said "Ah, kindred", I figgered that to mean he recognized a will and determination to live similar to his own in the face of what could have been both their ends. And when he said, directly to Deckard, "I've seen things you people wouldn't believe...", I thought he was referring to non-replicants, of which Deckard was a part.
This thread has me goin' more than i could have hoped, and Zoid, your analytical and reasioning powers are beyond compare. Mr. Holms has nuthin' on ya.
(..hey, are you a replicant?)
The fence-sittin' Chrisisall
NOTIFY: Y | REPLY | REPLY WITH QUOTE | PERMALINK | TOP | HOME
BlackoutNights, perhaps in the world of Blade Runner, a sense of humanity from a character may be the very reason that character is a replicant-? Except for Sebastian, most 'people' there don't seem to have much in the way of humanity. Just a thought.
Also, the voiceover does add some color to the movie, but it also takes away some of the 'starkness', like I said somwhere above, I can take it either way (my feathers ain't ruffled - hey, howdja know I had feathers?)
The all-too-human Chrisisall
NOTIFY: Y | REPLY | REPLY WITH QUOTE | PERMALINK | TOP | HOME
Just wait (and you will!) for the special edition on dvd, I can't wait for a truly clear picture.( I hear it's due out the year the movie's supposed to take place) 
The used-to-be-a-thirtysomething-also Chrisisall
NOTIFY: Y | REPLY | REPLY WITH QUOTE | PERMALINK | TOP | HOME
The true answer is there is no answer. Like most things, it's all in the eye of the beholder.
"We are the knights who say...KNEE!"
NOTIFY: Y | REPLY | REPLY WITH QUOTE | PERMALINK | TOP | HOME
That's the sheer beauty of it; the movie itself does'nt produce answers, it's mostly asking questions. Whether he is or isn't a replicant is irrelevant in the face of the question, 'What is it to be human, to be alive?'
An important question in an era of AI and genetic manipulation (the flick was 20 or 30 years ahead of it's time).
"A certain point of view?" Chrisisall
NOTIFY: Y | REPLY | REPLY WITH QUOTE | PERMALINK | TOP | HOME
Zoid, a few more words, and my journey towards the replicant side will be complete.
The seen ROTJ too many times Chrisisall
NOTIFY: Y | REPLY | REPLY WITH QUOTE | PERMALINK | TOP | HOME
SergeantX:
It's 2:17 AM CDT, I just got in from a swing shift and am going to bed pronto; but I just had to say that you were dead right. As Gaff said, "It's too bad she won't live; but then again, who does?" Do you know your expiration date? We take our every breath in the shadow of death. (NB: Poet, didn't know it.)
But I think the movie goes further than that. It asks the question: "How close to human must a machine get before the machine must be considered human itself?" This is echoed in Tyrell's motto (and Rob Zombie's borrowed lyric), "More human than human." The movie's kind of a working example of the Turing Test.
For me, Gaff is a central character, Ridley-in-the-machine (or '-movie', if that helps). Aside from his origami skills, his physical reactions to Deckard are telling, too. He hardly speaks to Deckard. When they are in the aircar together, it's as though Deckard wasn't even there, or as though he were just tending the machinery. I always got the impression that Gaff was watching him out of the corner of his eye, cooly observing him. And it's odd that Gaff always seems to be appearing from nowhere. He seems to know exactly where Deckard is, but offers no assistance (as in the entire Bradbury Hotel sequence at the end, when he shows up only after Batty has expired).
I think Gaff is Deckard's handler. Why would he toss Deckard a gun, after Batty was dead? The entire scene goes:
Quote:
Gaff: You've done a man's job, sir. I guess you're through, huh?
Deckard: Finished.
[Gaff throws Deckard the gun]
Gaff: It's too bad she won't live! But then again, who does?
I think Gaff was saying, "I'm supposed to retire you once you've finished this job, but I'm not going to."
(NB: And in case anybody missed it in one of the other threads, I think Edward James Olmos is a magnificent actor. Catch him every time you get a chance, like in "Battlestar Galactica". He's physically subtle.)
SergeantX: The next time you're renting old stuff at HollyBlockster, see if you can find a copy of "Zoot Suit", with EJO. It's really pretty crappy, with the exception of Olmos, who is jaw dropping. The expression tour de force comes to mind. And of course, "Stand And Deliver", for which he was Oscar-nominated Best Leading Actor in 1989.
chrisisall:
Please note Roy's inflection on the word "people". He is making no distinction between himself and Deckard.
B.o.N.:
Call Ridley Scott a liar if you want; I take no offense. When I read the novelette, "Do Androids Dream Of Electric Sheep?", after having seen "Blade Runner", I was immediately struck by the fact that the movie and novelette were completely different. In "...Sheep", Deckard's more of a flat foot, ploddingly hunting down a bunch of frightened androids, who act like Jewish escapees hiding in attics to avoid discovery by the Gestapo. The replicants in "...Sheep" are as timid as office workers and half as threatening. Are you sure you didn't read a novelization of "Blade Runner"?
Sleepily,
zoid
_________________________________________________
"We began to recognize in them a strange obsession. After all, they are emotionally inexperienced, with only a few years in which to store up the experiences which you and I take for granted. If we gift them with a past, we create a cushion or a pillow for their emotions, and consequently, we can control them better." -Tyrell, Blade Runner (emphasis mine)
NOTIFY: Y | REPLY | REPLY WITH QUOTE | PERMALINK | TOP | HOME