My Theory On Why Bush wants to Ruin Social Security

POSTED BY: piratejenny
UPDATED: Wednesday, February 8, 2006 17:07
VIEWED: 13307
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BYTETHEBULLET

Friday, March 11, 2005 2:23 AM

Quote:
Originally posted by piratejenny:

you know I wish it was as simple as your making it out to be but its not!!!

once again you people keep trying to make this about Democrates and Reps or conservative and Liberals its not, its got nothing to do with that, all you have to do is see whats going on, but you don't or you can't

All I have asked is for you to back up what you are saying but you have failed miserably. Some rebuttal.

You have a closed mind and you are unwilling to broaden your horizons by listening to anyone that has different views than you.

Oh, you were the one that made it about Republicans and Democrats when you started bashing President Bush and his administration. You should go over to the Democratic Underground forum, they would love you over there.

At least we can agree that Firefly is a great show.

ByteTheBullet (-:

HERO

Friday, March 11, 2005 3:03 AM

Quote:
Originally posted by piratejenny:
Quote:
Perhaps the real reason you find yourself in such vehement opposition to President Bush is because you find you have more in common with the likes of Saddam Hussein.

how dare you, Hero...I could think up another name for you and it wouldn't be Hero.., sometimes I read your post because even if I know that I probably won't agree with what you say because its nonesense most of the time but I figure hey keep an open mind the person still might have something insightful to say but you rarely ever do!!...I know what kind of person you are, as you've stated yourself with glee your the kind of person who would try to stop a little old lady from exercising her right to vote..yeah your some Hero!!

I think you are the person who finds that you have more in common with Saddam Hussein!! stop projecting yourself onto me!!

To borrow a phrase from Senator Byrd (D, WVa)): "I was speaking as a historian" when I invoked Saddam's name in this hallowed hall.

You selectively quoted me. Thats fine. I stand by the original post and the idea that you seem to support democracy and the rule of law only so far as they agree with you. That's a problem you share with extremists of both sides...and Saddam Hussein.

Maybe you would prefer I invoke a more dated reference...Emperor Caracalla of Rome perhaps?

As for the little old ladies. Its partly true. I tried to keep little old people of all kinds from voting...for John Kerry. Its called campaigning. Happens during an election. People vote, they count them, we win, you sue. Happens every couple years. I'd also like to take their driver's licenses away...but that's another issue.

H

INEVITABLEBETRAYAL

Friday, March 11, 2005 3:29 AM

Quote:
Originally posted by piratejenny:
how dare you, Hero...I could think up another name for you and it wouldn't be Hero.., sometimes I read your post because even if I know that I probably won't agree with what you say because its nonesense most of the time but I figure hey keep an open mind the person still might have something insightful to say but you rarely ever do!!

And how is that not insulting? How is that not petty? How is that not a preachy rant?

Honestly, Jenny, you have got to step back and let yourself calm down. You're speaking from pure unmediated passion. Passion isn't bad, but you have to channel it, direct it so that it will be effective. You're just sounding close-minded and ignorant.

Note that I say that sounding because I can't be sure that you really are as close-minded and ignorant as you seem to be. If you spoke less from passion and more from reason, I'd be able to effectively evaluate your arguments. But you aren't making any.

What you are making are accusations and pronouncements. You say that "Bush wants to ruin Social Security"--that's not an argument, that's an accusation. If you want to make an argument, you need to present some information that will support your case. You say, "Social Security doesn't need fixing"--that's a pronouncement. Once again, to make an argument, you're going to have to lay out your case: give us the reasons why we should believe that.

All you have been doing is stomping your feet and yelling harder. That may work on the playground among 12 year olds, but intelligent discussion requires reason. To be effectively persuasive, you have to convince someone of the merits of your case. All you have been doing is saying, "If you don't agree with me, it's because you are not aware of what's really going on". OK--well bring it. Tell us what's going on. Lay out your evidence. Show us why you're right. All you've done so far is grow more and more hysterical. And that's hardly a persuasive method of argumentation.

_______________________________________________
I wish I had a magical wish-granting plank.

SOUPCATCHER

Friday, March 11, 2005 7:31 AM

Quote:
Originally posted by Hero:
To borrow a phrase from Senator Byrd (D, WVa)): "I was speaking as a historian" when I invoked Saddam's name in this hallowed hall.

LOL. Why am I not surprised that you're tapped into the outrage of the day, Hero?

I totally missed the reference when I read it a few minutes ago but after getting my semi-regular dose of Molly Ivins it all makes sense.

PIRATEJENNY

Friday, March 11, 2005 8:44 AM

Quote:
Originally posted by ByteTheBullet:
Quote:
Originally posted by piratejenny:

you know I wish it was as simple as your making it out to be but its not!!!

once again you people keep trying to make this about Democrates and Reps or conservative and Liberals its not, its got nothing to do with that, all you have to do is see whats going on, but you don't or you can't

All I have asked is for you to back up what you are saying but you have failed miserably. Some rebuttal. You have a closed mind and you are unwilling to broaden your horizons by listening to anyone that has different views than you.

Oh, you were the one that made it about Republicans and Democrats when you started bashing President Bush and his administration. You should go over to the Democratic Underground forum, they would love you over there.

At least we can agree that Firefly is a great show.

ByteTheBullet (-:

I think I've more then backed up what I was saying, I read your 1rst post and I found it to be patronzing and long winded just the same thing, and no I did not make this about Reps and Dems you did that

I honestly could careless about either party, Bush and his administration are the ones that are changing laws and the constitution so therefore I'm going to mention them..your stuck on reps and dems...which frankly I'm beyond...I'm looking at actions and the outcome of those actions and who is behind those actions!!! wether it be reps or dems to me is not even the issue..its the fact that its being done!!

if anyone is closed minded its you..you who can't seem to look beyond political parties and not what is actually going on!!

but yeah if nothing else we can agree that Firefly is great!!!

PIRATEJENNY

Friday, March 11, 2005 8:54 AM

Quote:
You selectively quoted me. Thats fine. I stand by the original post and the idea that you seem to support democracy and the rule of law only so far as they agree with you. That's a problem you share with extremists of both sides...and Saddam Hussein.

LMAO stand by what you want because your assumptions are wrong on both counts, I personally think your projecting but whatever works for you!!!

Quote:

Maybe you would prefer I invoke a more dated reference...Emperor Caracalla of Rome perhaps?

do what you like I'm sure you will anyway, I could careless espeically since I know nothing about this Emperor

Quote:
As for the little old ladies. Its partly true. I tried to keep little old people of all kinds from voting...for John Kerry. Its called campaigning. Happens during an election. People vote, they count them, we win, you sue. Happens every couple years. I'd also like to take their driver's licenses away...but that's another issue.

I always try to find something postive about someone if I can..at least you are honest as assine as you are or at least present yourself to be, some people seem to take great pleasure and pride in bing a 1rst class A-hole!!

PIRATEJENNY

Friday, March 11, 2005 9:26 AM

Quote:
Originally posted by InevitableBetrayal:

Quote:
Quote:

how dare you, Hero...I could think up another name for you and it wouldn't be Hero.., sometimes I read your post because even if I know that I probably won't agree with what you say because its nonesense most of the time but I figure hey keep an open mind the person still might have something insightful to say but you rarely ever do!!]

And how is that not insulting? How is that not petty? How is that not a preachy rant?

1rst of all that post was directed at me and not at the issue at hand it was more personal and I felt it was insulting being compared to Saddam is insulting espeically when there was no reason to go there...it wasan A and B convo no need for you to C your way in not on this one!!!

Quote:

Honestly, Jenny, you have got to step back and let yourself calm down. You're speaking from pure unmediated passion. Passion isn't bad, but you have to channel it, direct it so that it will be effective. You're just sounding close-minded and ignorant.

I might be passionate but I'm not speaking from pure passion, Bush and his administration has done everything that I've said you maynot agree or see it the same as I do but its not like I'm making any of this stuff up..

Quote:
Note that I say that sounding because I can't be sure that you really are as close-minded and ignorant as you seem to be. If you spoke less from passion and more from reason, I'd be able to effectively evaluate your arguments. But you aren't making any.

I didn't start this thread to argue with anyone I was simply stating my theory/opinion of why Bush and his administration is trying to ruin Social Security take that how you want I gave my reasons for it and explained it . I didn't ever say you had to believe it or agree with it, perhaps I should have went into more detail as signym did in explaining the fees and such, sometimes I post thinking that people know about whats going on and not everyone is as up to date or aware. but my objective really wasn't to explain anything anyway it was simply to voice my opinion. maybe if you had not started in on the reps Dems stuff and had just asked me to clarify what I was talking about instead of going off on a tangent I would have done just that!!

Quote:
What you are making are accusations and pronouncements. You say that "Bush wants to ruin Social Security"--that's not an argument, that's an accusation. If you want to make an argument, you need to present some information that will support your case. You say, "Social Security doesn't need fixing"--that's a pronouncement. Once again, to make an argument, you're going to have to lay out your case: give us the reasons why we should believe that.

yep it is an accusation and just becaused I accused him and his corrupt administration of trying to ruin Social Security doesn't mean it isn't true...I'll say it again I was never trying to argue a point in the 1rst place. for one I didn't think I had to because it is a fact that Bush is trying to Privatize Social Security, that alone speaks for itself second it doesn't take a brainac to know that gambling with a goverment insurance program would be a failer its common sense Social Security is not an IRA or a 401K... thats why its called Social Security Security being highlighed for effect!!

being a thinker I had to ask why? would he try to do this..and I came up with a theory on it.

so there you have it!!

privitizing Social Security wouldn't work it would be a diseaster, the fees that you would have to pay to the banks and brokers is reason enough , not to mention that the Stockmarket is not reliable, that would amount to gambling

so why would Bush want to do it..it would make the rich already richer while the economy gets worse because of lack of jobs and a soft dollar it would insure a steady flow of money into Corporations and big business, it would cushion the rich from the failing economy while the poor just gets poorer...that was my theory

[

INEVITABLEBETRAYAL

Friday, March 11, 2005 1:43 PM

Quote:
Originally posted by piratejenny:
I guess its a hard concept for some of you to grasp that people can think for themselves, that based on whats happening that people can draw their own conclusions, its seems to be a foreign concept to some of you..you guys might want to try it sometime who knows you might can come up with a few theorys of your own based on whats happening if you actually gave it some thought !!

Ah, Jenny, still fiddling as the ship goes down...

Yet again, you've proved my point. I asked you to show me facts; I asked you to give me data; I asked you to make a cogent argument. And once again, you accused me of 1) not thinking for myself, and 2) not having my own theories about what's going on.

What doesn't seem to be be registering to that brain of yours is that it is entirely possible for someone to examine the same facts, to be fully aware of a situation to apply a good amount of thought to an issue--and then come up with something different than you. What you seem to be doing is saying that everyone who disagrees with you is just stupid or uniformed. Every single time you've responded to me, to Byte, to Hero, you've accused us of not thinking, not coming up with our own ideas, and not being aware of current events.

I think you're just plain wrong. We're not insulting you--we're disagreeing with you. Why can't you seem to wrap your head around that concept?

Honestly, your angry rants and smug assurance that you--and you alone--know the reality of Social Security and the Bush administration are seriously hurting your credibility. At this point, it's hard to take anything you say seriously because you just seem to want to throw a fit if we don't fall right in line with your beliefs. What is this, third grade? Grow up, Jenny.

_______________________________________________
I wish I had a magical wish-granting plank.

BYTETHEBULLET

Friday, March 11, 2005 2:24 PM

Quote:
Originally posted by InevitableBetrayal:
Quote:
Originally posted by piratejenny:
I guess its a hard concept for some of you to grasp that people can think for themselves, that based on whats happening that people can draw their own conclusions, its seems to be a foreign concept to some of you..you guys might want to try it sometime who knows you might can come up with a few theorys of your own based on whats happening if you actually gave it some thought !!

Ah, Jenny, still fiddling as the ship goes down...

Yet again, you've proved my point. I asked you to show me facts; I asked you to give me data; I asked you to make a cogent argument. And once again, you accused me of 1) not thinking for myself, and 2) not having my own theories about what's going on.

What doesn't seem to be be registering to that brain of yours is that it is entirely possible for someone to examine the same facts, to be fully aware of a situation to apply a good amount of thought to an issue--and then come up with something different than you. What you seem to be doing is saying that everyone who disagrees with you is just stupid or uniformed. Every single time you've responded to me, to Byte, to Hero, you've accused us of not thinking, not coming up with our own ideas, and not being aware of current events.

I think you're just plain wrong. We're not insulting you--we're disagreeing with you. Why can't you seem to wrap your head around that concept?

Honestly, your angry rants and smug assurance that you--and you alone--know the reality of Social Security and the Bush administration are seriously hurting your credibility. At this point, it's hard to take anything you say seriously because you just seem to want to throw a fit if we don't fall right in line with your beliefs. What is this, third grade? Grow up, Jenny.

_______________________________________________
I wish I had a magical wish-granting plank.

I could not have said it better, thank you InevitableBetrayal.

That being said, I will leave this thread never to return as it is stuck in an endless loop.

I wish the best for all of you.

ByteTheBullet (-:

INEVITABLEBETRAYAL

Friday, March 11, 2005 3:10 PM

Quote:
Originally posted by ByteTheBullet:

I could not have said it better, thank you InevitableBetrayal.

That being said, I will leave this thread never to return as it is stuck in an endless loop.

I wish the best for all of you.

ByteTheBullet (-:

Take it easy Byte. Hope I run into you in a more civil thread.

_______________________________________________
I wish I had a magical wish-granting plank.

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