wolfram and hart

POSTED BY: est120
UPDATED: Friday, April 15, 2005 07:45
VIEWED: 7671
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GROUNDED

Friday, November 26, 2004 8:39 PM

Angel already knows the Senior Partners are not human - go rewatch Reprise.

ZEEK

Thursday, December 2, 2004 5:07 PM

I think the books were just there so that wes and the others could find out that the priest dudes were evil. That's all really.

The thing I was disappointed about was never getting to see any of the senior partners. Are they humans? Demons? A mix? Floating balls of light? What?

I always sorta hoped Joss would blind side us with something like the senior partners and the powers that be end up being one in the same or something. I don't know how he could work that out but it coulda been cool. Maybe when Jasmine came around he could have done it. Something like the powers that be had them doing good things but they were really just setting things up for something bad to happen. OK I'm done rambling.

CAPTAINCDC

Thursday, December 2, 2004 9:16 PM

Quote:
Originally posted by Zeek:
I think the books were just there so that wes and the others could find out that the priest dudes were evil. That's all really.

The thing I was disappointed about was never getting to see any of the senior partners. Are they humans? Demons? A mix? Floating balls of light? What?

I always sorta hoped Joss would blind side us with something like the senior partners and the powers that be end up being one in the same or something. I don't know how he could work that out but it coulda been cool. Maybe when Jasmine came around he could have done it. Something like the powers that be had them doing good things but they were really just setting things up for something bad to happen. OK I'm done rambling.

I agree about the books. I think they were there to give the characters natural momentum to wrap up the story, to make them think we can't hang around, we are in imminent danger, we have to get the hell out of here now. And also to remind/inform the characters that the senior partners are bigger and badder than they originally thought.

As to the senior partners and the P'sTB being one in the same, I think they could have pulled it off. They could have said that in everything you have to have balance; light and dark, black and white, up and down, good and evil. In order to preserve the balance of nature they had to play both sides against each other. It would have been quite a blow to Angel & Co to learn that they had been serving both good and evil.

Ka is a wheel, time but a face on the water.

GROUNDED

Thursday, December 2, 2004 11:13 PM

I think that's pretty much the sentiment of a lot of S2, culminating in the best quote ever: "If nothing we do matters, then all that matters is what we do."

CAPTAINCDC

Friday, December 3, 2004 5:27 PM

Quote:
Originally posted by Grounded:
I think that's pretty much the sentiment of a lot of S2, culminating in the best quote ever: "If nothing we do matters, then all that matters is what we do."

I agree Grounded, that is one of my favorite quotes of all time.

Ka is a wheel, time but a face on the water.

SHANYU

Friday, February 18, 2005 12:52 AM

Quote:
Originally posted by est120:
okay, i have seen basically all the episodes of angel. albeit, i have missed a handful (maybe 5). currently in the TNT reruns, the series is right at the start of season 3 when the gang is trying to return to our dimension from pylea. here is my question:

Select to view spoiler:

in the episode "through the looking glass", wesley is studying from some books from the covenant that put cordelia into power and he notices that the three volumes have symbols on the front cover, namely a wolf, a ram and a hart. thus, wolfram and hart. now, granted i have not seen all the episodes, i am wondering if this connection to the law firm of wolfram and hart ever comes up again? i do not remember it being mentioned in the latter half of season 3 nor in any susequent seasons. is this just a side story that gets abandoned?

anyway, i am just curious.

That concept was far from abandonded, the entire show rests on the back of how big and powerful the wolf the ram and the hart are. They are as continuously said in season 5 a multi-dimensional corperation. Illyria knows of the wolf ram and hart from her time. And hamilton talks about the power of the wolf ram and heart being in his blood, running through his veins(which ironically leads to the death of hamilton... really shouldnt have said blood)But this concwept is constantly metions throught the course of the show.

"You can live with a man for fourty years , share his meals, talk on every subject, then tie him up, and hold him over the volanoes edge. And on that day, you will finally meet the man"

GROUNDED

Saturday, February 19, 2005 12:12 AM

Mentioning and actually doing something with it are two entirely different things.

CANTTAKESKY

Tuesday, February 22, 2005 4:20 PM

Quote:
Mentioning and actually doing something with it are two entirely different things.

The series was prematurely cancelled. I believe they would have ultimately revealed the mystery of the Senior Partners (the wolf, the ram, and the hart) had they gotten 2 more seasons to tell the story. Over the 5 seasons, the question "Who are the Senior Partners and how do I get to them?" was answered in small increments with each little mention of W,R & H. They simply didn't get the chance to finish the answer.

In BtVS, they raised the question of the first Slayer, but didn't fully reveal how she came to be until the final season. Similarly, they introduced the First and its bringers in season 2 as seemingly the monster of the week, but didn't fully explain their significance until season 7.

So no, I do not believe the clue to W,R,&H was abandoned. Just the opposite. It was a crucial revelation that the were meting out in small rations. This was the first time that we were told the Senior Partners are not 2 (W&H), but 3 (W,R,&H) --and that they have some connection to the animal forms of a wolf, a ram, and a hart. We can infer that they are inextricably entwined with one another, and that the 3 can only have power together (like the books). With Illyria's comment, we know that the 3 are ancient and have been together from the beginning of time, when they were only a tad above vampires. Now they have gotten so powerful that they can affect multiple dimensions and even have worshippers (at least in Pylea, and probably others as well).

In my mind, I imagine them to have started out somewhat like the demon version of the Triad in BtVS. Over eons, they have managed to evolve into godlike powers. I believe had the series had a chance to continue, Joss would have eventually revealed who they are, what their agenda is, and where Angel and the prophecies fit in.

Can't Take My Gorram Sky

GROUNDED

Wednesday, February 23, 2005 10:37 AM

Quote:
Originally posted by canttakesky:
In BtVS, they raised the question of the first Slayer, but didn't fully reveal how she came to be until the final season. Similarly, they introduced the First and its bringers in season 2 as seemingly the monster of the week, but didn't fully explain their significance until season 7.

Joss has mentioned in interviews that they didn't plan things very far ahead. I very much doubt the First was conceived as a future nemesis, 4 seasons in advance.

CYBERSNARK

Wednesday, February 23, 2005 3:27 PM

Quote:
Originally posted by canttakesky:
In my mind, I imagine them to have started out somewhat like the demon version of the Triad in BtVS.

*collapses in hysterical giggles*

"So. . . Wanna take over the multiverse?"
". . . Okay."
"Sure."

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We applied the cortical electrodes but were unable to get a neural reaction from either patient.

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