Hollywood's Abysmal 2023 in Numbers
POSTED BY: 6ixStringJack
UPDATED: Friday, August 2, 2024 09:17
VIEWED: 13031
PAGE 14 of 25
Japan not Hollywood
$11,500,000 aprox opening
42 Million Worldwide
Budget $15 million and yet it has huge box office special fx cgi
if we go by the SixString Budget X 2.5 rule it would need to make 37.5 Million to start profit
https://forums.boxofficetheory.com/topic/31519-godzilla-minus-one-japa
n-11323-north-america-12123-wide-release/page/2/#comments
NOTIFY: N | REPLY | REPLY WITH QUOTE | PERMALINK | TOP | HOME
Quote:
Originally posted by JAYNEZTOWN:
Japan not Hollywood
$11,500,000 aprox opening
42 Million Worldwide
Budget $15 million and yet it has huge box office special fx cgi
if we go by the SixString Budget X 2.5 rule it would need to make 37.5 Million to start profit
https://forums.boxofficetheory.com/topic/31519-godzilla-minus-one-japa
n-11323-north-america-12123-wide-release/page/2/#comments
Was my old man correct saying that it wasn't dubbed and it's got subtitles?
If that's true, its performance so far even in the US has been pretty damned impressive.
2nd place on Thursday Previews and Friday Opening last week, only behind Beyonce's thing.
3rd place on Saturday and Sunday behind Songbirds and Snakes and Beyonce's thing.
1st place on Monday above Songbirds & Snakes (Beyonce's thing doesn't play Mon-Wed)
2nd place on Cheap Seat Tuesday behind Songbirds & Snakes. (By just $84k)
1st place again on Wednesday above Songbirds & Snakes.
And Bruce confirms the $15 Million Production Budget on The-Numbers.
This means with $38,721,500 it's already grossed over $1.2 Million profit and everything else it makes is gravy.
Unfortunately, it appears that The Boy and the Heron might have had a HUGE Production Budget. I can't find anyone stating any guesstimates let alone solid figures, but some are calling it the most expensive film ever made in Japan. (Though that's probably not saying much since a movie like Godzilla Minus One can be made in Japan for only $15 Million).
They're saying that it took 7 years to make.
It's definitely on my very, very short list of movies that I intend on watching.
It's already made $73,383,575 Internationally, with $56 Million of that from Japan and $15 Million from South Korea. Supposedly they haven't spent ANY money on marketing this movie, and any business it's gotten was word of mouth.
It will be interesting to see what the Production Budget actually was.
--------------------------------------------------
Political correctness is just tyranny, with a smiley face.
NOTIFY: Y | REPLY | REPLY WITH QUOTE | PERMALINK | TOP | HOME
BoxOfficePro predicted $10.2 Million and a first place finish for The Boy and the Heron this weekend.
The-Numbers predicts $14.6 Million and a first place finish for The Boy and the Heron.
I don't know if we're actually ever going to see the actual production budget on this one. It's not the first time a animated feature came out of Japan this year and didn't make my lists because there is no budget data.
Interestingly, there is a possibility that The Boy and the Heron and Godzilla Minus One take 1st and 2nd place for the weekend. I wonder if this would be the first time in history where the top two spots were foreign films.
With the $2.39 Million that TB&TH made on preview night for 1st place, Godzilla took 2nd place barely from Beyonce's concert thing on Thursday night. They probably won't take 1st and 2nd, but I'm rooting for them.
--------------------------------------------------
Political correctness is just tyranny, with a smiley face.
NOTIFY: Y | REPLY | REPLY WITH QUOTE | PERMALINK | TOP | HOME
The Boy in the Heron gets $3,170,000 on Friday after subtracting the $2,390,000 for Preview Thursday.
This is still enough to take 1st place over Songbirds & Snakes' $2,700,000.
Godzilla Minus One gets $2,250,000 for 3rd place.
Beyonce in 4th place with only $1,600,000 with a huge -86% drop from last Friday.
It will be interesting to see the top list for the weekend. S&S appears to be doing better on weekends comparative to the competition than it does on week days.
--------------------------------------------------
Political correctness is just tyranny, with a smiley face.
NOTIFY: Y | REPLY | REPLY WITH QUOTE | PERMALINK | TOP | HOME
Bummer...
Unless projections were off by a little over a million (highly unlikely, given the low box office numbers all around this weekend), it looks as though S&S made enough money to hold Godzilla to 3rd place.
A record was broken this weekend though. The Boy and the Heron was the best US opening by Miyazaki ever. There's a pretty good chance this one not only ends up being the highest grossing Miyazaki film in the US ever, but it will do it with inflation adjustments as well.
All Top 10 films this weekend were from a different studio as well. 6 of them were Indie.
--------------------------------------------------
Political correctness is just tyranny, with a smiley face.
NOTIFY: Y | REPLY | REPLY WITH QUOTE | PERMALINK | TOP | HOME
Damn... Godzilla Minus One was only $700k behind Songbirds and Snakes.
Oh well... The window for the top 2 films being foreign ones closed just as soon as it opened.
I'm sure Wonka is going to be garbage, but I'd be extremely surprised if it wasn't 1st place by a pretty wide margin this weekend.
--------------------------------------------------
Political correctness is just tyranny, with a smiley face.
NOTIFY: Y | REPLY | REPLY WITH QUOTE | PERMALINK | TOP | HOME
An Older Example of a Hollywood Failure.
The Last Emperor (1987) sold $44,005,435 in tickets but cost $25,000,000 to make. It lost money.
https://www.the-numbers.com/movie/Last-Emperor-The-(1987)#tab=summary
But The Last Emperor won 9 Oscars, including Best Picture, Best Director, Best Screenplay.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Last_Emperor#Accolades
Critics highly praised The Last Emperor.
https://www.metacritic.com/movie/the-last-emperor/
And the Pirates recently appreciated the old movie. It was restored in 4K in 2023 to its original 2.35:1 aspect ratio rather than cinematographer Vittorio Storaro’s preference for a cropped 2:1 version.
https://search.rlsbb.ru/?s=The+Last+Emperor
https://pirate-proxy.top/search.php?q=the+last+emperor
The Joss Whedon script for Serenity, where Wash lives, is Serenity-190pages.pdf at
https://www.mediafire.com/folder/1uwh75oa407q8/Firefly
NOTIFY: Y | REPLY | REPLY WITH QUOTE | PERMALINK | TOP | HOME
Quote:
Originally posted by second:
An Older Example of a Hollywood Failure.
The Last Emperor (1987) sold $44,005,435 in tickets but cost $25,000,000 to make. It lost money.
https://www.the-numbers.com/movie/Last-Emperor-The-(1987)#tab=summary
But The Last Emperor won 9 Oscars, including Best Picture, Best Director, Best Screenplay.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Last_Emperor#Accolades
Critics highly praised The Last Emperor.
https://www.metacritic.com/movie/the-last-emperor/
Most Oscar Winning pictures aren't made for people who pay to see movies, and if they cost a lot of money to make they lose money.
With inflation included, The Last Emperor cost $67,572,843 to make in 2023, which isn't even a huge budget compared to today's Oscar-bait movies like Killers of the Flower Moon and Napoleon which both cost $200 Million to make.
At $44 Million in Box Office receipts, it grossed $118,928,204, or roughly 176% of the production budget. Under today's 2.5x Rule of Thumb it would have been a huge loser, but since the RoT was only 2 times before Bidenflation kicked in it's reasonable to assume* that all the way back in 1987 it was even less than that and this one at least was close to breaking even, specifically because of its low production budget.
_________________________________
*NOTE: This assumption appears to be backed up by using the Super Bowl cost for a 30 second Ad Spot by year:
https://www.superbowl-ads.com/cost-of-super-bowl-advertising-breakdown
-by-year/
In 1987, a 30 second Super Bowl ad spot cost $645,000. In 2022, it cost $7,000,000.
That's a 1,085% increase in cost over 35 years, which far outpaces inflation. If the cost of advertising remained constant with inflation, the cost of $645,000 for a 30 second ad spot during the Super Bowl in 1987 would only be $1,661,641 in 2022. In other words, it cost 421% more to advertise last year compared to what it should have had advertising kept pace with inflation.
However, it doesn't appear to be aided much by Theater Takes using this table on US average ticket prices by year:
https://www.natoonline.org/data/ticket-price/
The average cost of a ticket in 1987 was $3.91, and the average price for a ticket in 2022 was $10.53, which is very close to matching the pace of inflation since the price in 2022 should be $10.07 per ticket in 2022.
So while the studios would make a little bit more money beyond inflation on their share of ticket prices being slightly higher than inflation would dictate in 2022, it's a pittance to how much less they had to spend on advertising back in 1987 compared to 2022.
_________________________________
Compared to Killers and Napoleon, because of its low production budget by comparison, it was far more successful than they were, even if it did lose the studio money. Killers has only made $154.8 Million (or 77.5% of its production budget, and Napoleon has only made $172 Million (or 86% of its production budget).
Quote:
And the Pirates recently appreciated the old movie. It was restored in 4K in 2023 to its original 2.35:1 aspect ratio rather than cinematographer Vittorio Storaro’s preference for a cropped 2:1 version.
Causation doesn't equate to correlation.
The Studio that owned the rights to The Last Emperor appreciated the old movie by restoring it in 4k in its original aspect ratio.
Pirates uploaded it and made it available online illegally for free because pirates do that with every movie. Even the really shitty ones that nobody could ever argue should be winning any awards.
--------------------------------------------------
Political correctness is just tyranny, with a smiley face.
NOTIFY: Y | REPLY | REPLY WITH QUOTE | PERMALINK | TOP | HOME
Quote:Lawrence of Arabia (1962) won Best Picture, Best Director, Best Cinematography/Sound/Music and it made a profit but audiences don't usually care about movies that are real. Oppenheimer is the most recent exception. The Last Emperor, Napoleon, and The Killers of the Flower Moon are all real people, so all three went down the toilet.
Originally posted by 6ixStringJack:
Most Oscar Winning pictures aren't made for people who pay to see movies, and if they cost a lot of money to make they lose money.
With inflation included, The Last Emperor cost $67,572,843 to make in 2023, which isn't even a huge budget compared to today's Oscar-bait movies like Killers of the Flower Moon and Napoleon which both cost $200 Million to make.
At $44 Million in Box Office receipts, it grossed $118,928,204, or roughly 176% of the production budget. Under today's 2.5x Rule of Thumb it would have been a huge loser, but since the RoT was only 2 times before Bidenflation kicked in it's reasonable to assume* that all the way back in 1987 it was even less than that and this one at least was close to breaking even, specifically because of its low production budget.
Some say that Lawrence fictionalized his story about his time in Arabia and the movie looked like a feverish dream with heat shimmering off the sands, so maybe Lawrence of Arabia is not about a real person but more a fiction/fantasy/horror movie, which explains why it made money. I'm still unsure why Oppenheimer made money because it is talk-talk-talk with very few explosions.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lawrence_of_Arabia_(film)#Awards_and_hon
ours
https://www.the-numbers.com/movie/Lawrence-of-Arabia#tab=summary
The Joss Whedon script for Serenity, where Wash lives, is Serenity-190pages.pdf at
https://www.mediafire.com/folder/1uwh75oa407q8/Firefly
NOTIFY: Y | REPLY | REPLY WITH QUOTE | PERMALINK | TOP | HOME
Quote:
Originally posted by second:Quote:Lawrence of Arabia (1962) won Best Picture, Best Director, Best Cinematography/Sound/Music and it made a profit but audiences don't usually care about movies that are real. Oppenheimer is the most recent exception. The Last Emperor, Napoleon, and The Killers of the Flower Moon are all real people, so all three went down the toilet.
Originally posted by 6ixStringJack:
Most Oscar Winning pictures aren't made for people who pay to see movies, and if they cost a lot of money to make they lose money.
With inflation included, The Last Emperor cost $67,572,843 to make in 2023, which isn't even a huge budget compared to today's Oscar-bait movies like Killers of the Flower Moon and Napoleon which both cost $200 Million to make.
At $44 Million in Box Office receipts, it grossed $118,928,204, or roughly 176% of the production budget. Under today's 2.5x Rule of Thumb it would have been a huge loser, but since the RoT was only 2 times before Bidenflation kicked in it's reasonable to assume* that all the way back in 1987 it was even less than that and this one at least was close to breaking even, specifically because of its low production budget.
Some say that Lawrence fictionalized his story about his time in Arabia and the movie looked like a feverish dream with heat shimmering off the sands, so maybe Lawrence of Arabia is not about a real person but more a fiction/fantasy/horror movie, which explains why it made money. I'm still unsure why Oppenheimer made money because it is talk-talk-talk with very few explosions.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lawrence_of_Arabia_(film)#Awards_and_hon
ours
https://www.the-numbers.com/movie/Lawrence-of-Arabia#tab=summary
The Joss Whedon script for Serenity, where Wash lives, is Serenity-190pages.pdf at
https://www.mediafire.com/folder/1uwh75oa407q8/Firefly
You won't get any argument out of me for any of that post.
I have no more clue why Oppenheimer was such an unbelievable success than I do why Barbie was such an unbelievable success. The whole Barbieheimer marketing thing was brilliant.
Oppenheimer looked boring and too long, and Barbie was an unabashed feminist flick using a kid's toy as the prop. Not only that... but I think Barbie was probably the most successful flick based off of a kid's toy in history too. I'm not going to bother researching all the kid's toy movies, but it destroyed Transformers, which only made $708 Million worldwide on a larger $151 Million budget (from 2007 and not adjusted for inflation).
We should probably just look at both of those as lightning-in-a-bottle outliers, because even if the execs know why they managed to market both of them to such great success, I doubt very much they'll ever be able to replicate that success.
Like I said a long time ago, if they think they're going to have another $1.5 Billion smash hit when they make a My Little Pony or Polly Pocket movie in a few years, we're going to get a big laugh out of it when they spend $200 Million making it and it doesn't break even.
And both the much-more-expensive-than-Oppenheimer Killers and Napoleon have shown that Oppenheimer is the exception to the rule.
I don't think they've ever made a historically accurate biopic into a real movie before. That includes Oppenheimer, Napoleon and Killers. Far too much artistic liberties are taken in any historical biopics, and the more millions thrown at it the worse that gets. If you want to see anything even remotely close to reality you need to get ready to be bored out of your skull and sit down and watch old NatGeo specials or stuff the History Channel made before they started churning out TV shows about Aliens and Ghosts being real because it turns out that's a lot more lucrative than showing programs about actual history. And even then, history is always written by the winners, so who's to say how much of that is even accurate.
Most people
NOTIFY: Y | REPLY | REPLY WITH QUOTE | PERMALINK | TOP | HOME