Is the military still under civilian control?
POSTED BY: 1KIKI
UPDATED: Wednesday, March 4, 2026 13:25
VIEWED: 4151
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When Trump ordered US troops to leave Syria, infamously, a significant number of troops didn't. I've never seen a real investigation into that. But those troops didn't just decide to stay of their own accord, as if the military was some vast democracy. Someone in the military didn't carry out their lawful orders.
Now we find out that General Milley looks to have been engaged in foreign policy with China.
Quote:
The Deeper Problem Behind General Milley’s ‘Secret Phone Calls’
Sept. 18, 2021
By Kori Schake
Ms. Schake, a foreign policy expert who worked for the National Security Council and the State Department during George W. Bush’s administration, is the director of foreign and defense policy studies at the American Enterprise Institute.
A new book reports that Gen. Mark Milley, the chairman of the Joint Chiefs of Staff, improperly restricted the president of the United States’ ability to use military force and committed to warning China, an American adversary, of any impending U.S. military action against it. If the book, “Peril,” by Bob Woodward and Robert Costa, accurately recounts General Milley’s behavior, his actions could be an egregious series of violations of the norms that govern civil-military relations in the United States.
The context surrounding General Milley’s actions is unclear and may be exculpating. For example, while The Washington Post’s description of “a pair of secret phone calls” suggests furtive behavior, Jennifer Griffin, a Fox News correspondent, reports that there were 15 people on the calls, including State Department representatives. It’s possible the calls were not secret from his civilian superiors, but carried that classification because any conversation with a foreign counterpart would. And the authors of “Peril” are unlikely to know whether the Chinese general “took the chairman at his word,” although they assert it.
There are also other potential explanations for General Milley’s actions less salacious than the Woodward and Costa telling accounts for. But the problem runs deeper than the specifics of General Milley’s actions and signals trouble for the relationship between our military and the civilians it is intended to serve.
A phone call between General Milley and Nancy Pelosi, the speaker of the House, was reported several months ago as General Milley explaining to the person second in the line of succession to the presidency the legal procedures for the president to initiate nuclear war, something valuable to reaffirm.
Though the president is commander in chief, Congress also provides civilian control of the military and requires every two-star general and above to commit to inform it of concerns they have about executive branch actions. So General Milley discussing the president’s soundness with the speaker of the House, while unseemly, could be understood as fulfilling his constitutional responsibilities.
It is also true that the U.S.-China military relationship is not well established, so it would be sensible to minimize miscalculation by the Chinese military, which probably poorly understands the American political process, in the confusion following the events of Jan. 6.
Quote:"Yet" is one of those "yes, but ..." phrases which mean "no".
Yet
Quote:
General Milley’s actions apparently came as a surprise to at least some Trump administration national security officials. Whether that’s indicative of a clandestine move by the chairman or simply the routine dysfunction of an administration that wasn’t well managed is difficult to assess. We may never find out the full story: It’s unlikely that General Milley or other military leaders would publicly rebut the account, since that would draw them further into the glare of civilian politics.
But even if the Woodward and Costa account sensationalizes General Milley’s actions, his choicesNOTIFY: Y | REPLY | REPLY WITH QUOTE | PERMALINK | TOP | HOME
Quote:
Originally posted by 1KIKI:
Is the military still under civilian control?
Surely, you jest.
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If you read further, Milley and Pelosi were colluding on this.
Also, according to Bob woodward's book, Milley downplayed the nationwide riots to Trump as "penny packet" so Trump wouldn't call in the troops. You can see collusion between Pelosi and Milley on this, too, as Pelosi "takes a knee" and sides with the rioters. Pelosi has been providing political cover for Milley's insubordination all along. THE PRESS provided disinformation cover.
Quote:a new book claims.
Milley warned Trump off violence against ‘penny packet’ George Floyd protesters, book claims
Gino Spocchia
Fri, September 17, 2021,
The chairman of the joint chiefs of staff [Milley] told Donald Trump that demonstrations over the death of George Floyd were "penny packet protests" and that those taking part were “not burning” America down,
CNN: "Fiery but mostly peaceful ..." in front of a building burning to the ground. At first I thought it was The Onion.
Quote:
According to an upcoming book by Washington Post reporters Bob Woodward and Robert Costa, Mark Milley sought to assure Mr Trump that Black Lives Matter demonstrators were not dangerous, and were not “burning America down”.
The conversation, which according to Fox News occurred in May 2020, was an apparent bid to ward Mr Trump off military action towards demonstrators after Floyd’s murder by police on 25 May in Minneapolis.
Rioting occurred in a number of US cities following Floyd’s death, causing Mr Trump to write on Twitter that "when the looting starts, the shooting starts" — in remarks that were condemned as an apparent incitement to violence.
“They used spray paint, Mr President, that’s not an insurrection," Gen Milley reportedly said of the demonstrators, who first assembled in Minneapolis. “They are not burning [America] down”.
https://www.yahoo.com/entertainment/milley-warned-trump-off-violence-1
41238543.html
Of course, mainstream coverage fails to mention that Milley told Trump that the protests only involved two cities, and also fails to mention the 19 dead people, hundreds of injuries to the police; use of lasers, fireworks and arson in an attemtp to injure or kill polie; and $2 billion in damage.
The articles ALSO fail to compare the nationwide, ANTI-POLICE violent BLM riots ("not an insurrection") that lasted months and months to the Jan 6 event, which idiots and disninformationalists have labeled an "insurrection" altho it didn't rise in violence anywhere near the BLM ("not an insurrection") riots.
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Pity would be no more,
If we did not MAKE men poor - William Blake
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If you read further, Milley and Pelosi were colluding on crafting foreign policy on China outside of Trump's direction, since she came out the day after he called and announced that there was "no danger'. CIA Haspell provided the disinformational context that Trump or his supporters were planning a "rightwing coup" - disinformation dutifuly amplified by the press.
Also, according to Bob woodward's book, Milley downplayed the nationwide riots to Trump as "penny packet" so Trump wouldn't call in the troops. You can see collusion between Pelosi and Milley on this, too, as Pelosi "takes a knee" and sides with the rioters. Pelosi has been providing political cover for Milley's insubordination all along. THE PRESS provided disinformation cover.
Quote:CNN: "Fiery but mostly peaceful ..." in front of a building burning to the ground. At first I thought it was The Onion.
Milley warned Trump off violence against ‘penny packet’ George Floyd protesters, book claims
Gino Spocchia
Fri, September 17, 2021,
The chairman of the joint chiefs of staff [Milley] told Donald Trump that demonstrations over the death of George Floyd were "penny packet protests" and that those taking part were “not burning” America down, a new book claims.
Quote:
According to an upcoming book by Washington Post reporters Bob Woodward and Robert Costa, Mark Milley sought to assure Mr Trump that Black Lives Matter demonstrators were not dangerous, and were not “burning America down”.
The conversation, which according to Fox News occurred in May 2020, was an apparent bid to ward Mr Trump off military action towards demonstrators after Floyd’s murder by police on 25 May in Minneapolis.
Rioting occurred in a number of US cities following Floyd’s death, causing Mr Trump to write on Twitter that "when the looting starts, the shooting starts" — in remarks that were condemned as an apparent incitement to violence.
“They used spray paint, Mr President, that’s not an insurrection," Gen Milley reportedly said of the demonstrators, who first assembled in Minneapolis. “They are not burning [America] down”.
https://www.yahoo.com/entertainment/milley-warned-trump-off-violence-1
41238543.html
Of course, mainstream coverage fails to mention that Milley told Trump that the protests only involved two cities, and also fails to mention the 19 dead people; hundreds of injuries to the police; use of lasers, fireworks and arson in an attempt to injure or kill police; and $2 billion in damage.
The articles ALSO fail to compare the nationwide, ANTI-POLICE violent BLM riots ("not an insurrection") that lasted months and months to the Jan 6 event, which idiots and disninformationalists have labeled an "insurrection" altho it didn't rise in violence anywhere near the BLM ("not an insurrection") riots.
-----------
Pity would be no more,
If we did not MAKE men poor - William Blake
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Sixty years ago, President Eisenhower knew he wasn't in control of the Pentagon. He punted the problem to "an alert and knowledgeable citizenry":
"We should take nothing for granted. Only an alert and knowledgeable citizenry can compel the proper meshing of the huge industrial and military machinery of defense with our peaceful methods and goals, so that security and liberty may prosper together." -- https://avalon.law.yale.edu/20th_century/eisenhower001.asp
Everybody knows that decisions on the battlefield are made solely by the military. But few civilians are aware that week by week and month by month the decisions are all made by the military. The only level where civilians can control the military is when the military budget is passed by Congress, if Congress for once changes what priorities will be funded. But Congress gives the Pentagon a yearly 3% raise, after accounting for inflation. No surprise that the Pentagon does whatever it wants, because it knows it will get a raise whether it wins a war or loses. Pentagon has nothing to fear from Congress because "support the troops" is a deep as the average Congressman thinks. Civilians have an even shallower understanding than Congress has about the military. "An alert and knowledgeable citizenry" does not describe America.
It’s Time to Rein in Inflated Military Budgets
https://www.scientificamerican.com/article/its-time-to-rein-in-inflate
d-military-budgets/
Quote:For all we know, the only thing stopping the Pentagon from bombing the Capitol building while Congress is in session is Congress dependably gives the Pentagon yearly raises.
By the Department of Defense’s own accounting, taxpayers spent $13.34 trillion on the U.S. military from 2000 through fiscal year 2019 in inflation-adjusted 2020 dollars. Add to that another $3.18 trillion for the Veterans Administration, and the yearly average comes to a whopping $826 billion.
No other country’s military outlays come close. In FY 2019, the Pentagon’s budget was nearly three times bigger than China’s defense spending and more than 10 times larger than Russia’s. All told, the U.S. military budget in 2019 exceeded the next 10 countries’ defense budgets combined and singlehandedly accounted for a hefty 38 percent of military spending worldwide.
The Joss Whedon script for Serenity, where Wash lives, is Serenity-190pages.pdf at https://www.mediafire.com/two
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In adddition, the STATE DEPARTMENT and it's conjoined twin THE CIA, is ALSO not under any President's control. In fact, Obama was doing State/CIA's bidding when he was in office, so they were controlling him.
Furthermore, the Pentagon and State/CIA don't necessarily see eye-to-eye on a number of policies, altho I think the CIA bought off some of the Pentagon to protect its drug-growing/ drug-running operation in Afghanistan.
And yes, I think the corruption goes that far.
-----------
Pity would be no more,
If we did not MAKE men poor - William Blake
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I've been puzzling over who's pulling Biden's* strings. Looking back on the Obama administration, it was obvious the CIA/ (deep) State Dept were running him. Looking back on Trump, it looks like he and the military were in a marriage of convenience, until the military decided it wanted out.
But so far the Biden* administration has been a puzzle.
The military seems to be now dealing directly with Congress in terms of US military policy and the related propaganda we're being fed. Perhaps its looking for a big budget score from Pelosi.
The Deep State sure does seem to be running Blinken, in its eagerness to antagonize both Russia AND China at the same time. Way to go!
So, whose shoulders does the Afghanistan withdrawal fumble rest on?
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Quote:
Originally posted by 1KIKI:
I've been puzzling over who's pulling Biden's* strings. Looking back on the Obama administration, it was obvious the CIA/ (deep) State Dept were running him. Looking back on Trump, it looks like he and the military were in a marriage of convenience, until the military decided it wanted out.
But so far the Biden* administration has been a puzzle.
China.
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Quote:Former Afghanistan President Ashraf Ghani and the Pentagon. The Pentagon should have forced Ghani to stay in the country for a few more weeks rather than hop in a helicopter with suitcases full of cash, which Ghani denies doing ha-ha, because the moment Ghani left, the Afghan Army collapsed. The collapse truly screwed up the Pentagon's withdrawal from Kabul. I guess the Pentagon didn't expect a former University of California Berkeley professor, Ghani, to be such a huge physical coward and a giant embezzler. But the Pentagon should have known Ghani's values were completely Americanized.
Originally posted by 1KIKI:
So, whose shoulders does the Afghanistan withdrawal fumble rest on?
Weeks after fleeing Afghanistan, former President Ashraf Ghani issues ‘explanation’ statement to Afghan people — only in English
https://www.cnbc.com/2021/09/09/ashraf-ghani-afghanistan-ex-president-
issues-explanation-after-fleeing.html
Ghani has two children, a daughter, Mariam, a Brooklyn-based visual artist, and a son, Tarek, who was a policy advisor to 2020 presidential candidate, Pete Buttigieg. Both were born in the United States and carry U.S. citizenship and passports. It was no surprise their father quit and ran in fear at the moment he was most needed to be brave by the Pentagon and Afghanistan.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ashraf_Ghani#Personal_life
The Joss Whedon script for Serenity, where Wash lives, is Serenity-190pages.pdf at https://www.mediafire.com/two
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Nobody cares about what happened with the Afghan troops. Really. That had zero to do with the planning and execution of US withdrawal.
The US military had a deadline date to meet to withdraw. The withdrawal wasn't completed in good order by that date. AFAIK the US military is on the same calendar the rest of the country is on.
So ... who fumbled the withdrawal?
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