Election fallout

POSTED BY: SignyM
UPDATED: Thursday, January 9, 2025 04:34
VIEWED: 11920
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SECOND

Friday, November 6, 2020 3:51 PM

Quote:
Originally posted by 1KIKI:
Chainsaw Al - sociopath or good guy?

Sociopath. Chainsaw Al is Albert J. Dunlap.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Albert_J._Dunlap

You can read about him in Top 10 Worst Bosses
http://content.time.com/time/specials/packages/article/0,28804,2025898
_2025900_2026107,00.html

The Joss Whedon script for Serenity, where Wash lives, is Serenity-190pages.pdf at www.mediafire.com/folder/1uwh75oa407q8/Firefly

1KIKI

Friday, November 6, 2020 7:19 PM

But he was so successful ... and ... rich ... the kind of person you admire the most.

SECOND

Friday, November 6, 2020 7:48 PM

Quote:
Originally posted by 1KIKI:
But he was so successful ... and ... rich ... the kind of person you admire the most.

How wrong you are, 1kiki. Dunlap is on the lists of "Worst CEOs of All Time" published by several business publications. Dunlap scores impressively on the Corporate Psychopathy checklist and in an interview, Dunlap freely admitted to possessing many of the traits of a psychopath, but considered them positive.

He engineered a massive accounting fraud at Nitec, a paper-mill company in Niagara Falls, New York. An audit revealed inflated inventory and non-existent sales — a situation similar to his later activities at Sunbeam. The board of directors of Sunbeam investigated aggressive accounting practices. Dunlap was fired. As the fraud was further uncovered, Sunbeam was forced a number of times to restate financial results. Sunbeam went bankrupt.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Albert_J._Dunlap

It is not profits that are evil; it is profit-seeking crooks such as Chainsaw Al Dunlap and real estate investor Trump that are evil -- long may he live -- in prison. (I have not yet found any Republican voter or businessman that quickly, intuitively, unfailingly understands the difference between an honest profit and a dishonest profit based on polluting the air or financial swindling or overcharging customers, etc. Maybe in Nebraska or Utah or Maine, but I can't find that Republican in Texas. Every Republican I know needs a lawyer to show them the line between honest/dishonest. They can't figure it out on their own for some reason.)

The Joss Whedon script for Serenity, where Wash lives, is Serenity-190pages.pdf at www.mediafire.com/folder/1uwh75oa407q8/Firefly

SIGNYM

Friday, November 6, 2020 10:41 PM

Quote:
SECOND: One President, I completely forget which one, had EPA rules against methane releases. Another President, I forget his name, but he has a history of being a sociopath according to his niece, withdrew the rules.

One President*,(*I forget his name) widely reported to be a sexual predator and pedophile, said I feel your pain then went on to destroy welfare as we know it
One President* pretended to be just like the rest of us and then deregulated the banks
One President* outsourced jobs with "free trade" deals.
One President* legalized commodities speculation.
One President* allowed media monopolization
One President's* DOJ protected the Microsoft monopoly and signed the DMCA
One President* took apart a nation in Europe and broke it into a half-dozen dysfunctional pieces

One President* oversaw the accession of China into the WTO
One President* lied us into TWO actual boots-on-the-ground wars in the Mideast
One President* forgave taxes for the rich
One President* established detention centers and the "enemy combatant" category which allowed mass imprisonment without Geneva Convention oversight
One President* obtained authorization for a borderless, boundary-less war, endless "global war" on ... something
One President* used extraordinary rendition and torture
One President* established a surveillance center in one main AT&T switchsystem by installing a splitter for direct access to AT&T transmissions

One President* (*I forget his name), said he would have the most transparent administration ever, then went on the prosecute more whistleblowers than all other Presidents combined
One President*, (*I forget his name), when faced with a historic financial crisis and opportunity for real financial reform, appointed Wall Street insider, then went on to disgorge TRILLIONS of dollars to the banks .... without a single prosecution for robo-signing and other fraudulent practices
One President, using cooperative NGOs, secret drone wars, the State Department, the CIA and Nazi and/or jihadi proxies, destablizized five nations and created hellholes of misery on three continents
One President* created a secret "kill list" and killed at least one American citizen without trial
One President* expanded the original (illegal) surveillance program to include every American at home and abroad, and built a massive data center for all of that info
One President* attempted to not only offshore American jobs but also cede American authority and democratic process to foreign interests
One President* promised public option healthcare, then signed a plan that would shove Americans into a bloated corporate healthcare system, with a sweetener of tax dollars that only made the hospital corporations and big pharma richer

As you can see, SECOND, although some of our Presidents have done SOME good, they have done FAR MORE to continue to develop and expand a system which inexorably funnels money to the wealthiest, and cede control to the economic elites abroad.

Why do you keep pretending this is all "one side's" fault?

We are at a stage when money rules our government, especially at the national and international level.

This isn't a "President" problem, or a "Republican" or "Democrat" problems, or a "Congressional" problem or "media" problem or even a "deep state" problem, this has become a SYSTEMS problem.

Our entire system: our laws and lawmakers, our media, our ethics, our military, our taxes, our spook agencies, our foreign policy establishment, and most of our NGOs ... every aspect of our lives that nudges or compels us to do one thing over another ... is wrapped around the goal of making the powerful ... more powerful.

SO FAR BEYOND MERE POLITICAL PARTIES.

You start being interesting, and then you go off the rails into your private war on the GOP again.

Sigh.

Keep your eye on the ball, m'kay?

-----------
Pi

SECOND

Friday, November 6, 2020 11:20 PM

Quote:
Originally posted by SIGNYM:

As you can see, SECOND, although some of our Presidents have done SOME good, they have done FAR MORE to continue to develop and expand a system which inexorably funnels money to the wealthiest, and cede control to the economic elites abroad.

Why do you keep pretending this is all "one side's" fault?

We are at a stage when money rules our government, especially at the national and international level.

This isn't a "President" problem, or a "Republican" or "Democrat" problems, or a "Congressional" problem or "media" problem or even a "deep state" problem, this has become a SYSTEMS problem.

Our entire system: our laws and lawmakers, our media, our ethics, our military, our taxes, our spook agencies, our foreign policy establishment, and most of our NGOs ... every aspect of our lives that nudges or compels us to do one thing over another ... is wrapped around the goal of making the rich ... richer.

SO FAR BEYOND MERE POLITICAL PARTIES.

You start being interesting, and then you go off the rails into your private war on the GOP again.

Sigh.

Keep your eye on the ball, m'kay?

You called profit a physics problem comparable to gravity. You also called it a systems problem. It is neither. It's a human problem.

Now I launch into an old man hinting at his career as an engineer. When I was designing control systems for petrochemical plants, the difference between a systems problem and a human problem was always the main thing we think about. The human operators of these plants were not created even approximately equal. Some were attentive and others should never be allowed in a control room. Rather than telling you how I handled that problem, let me point you to something far easier for you to understand: How to keep incompetent, dangerous, suicidal, or drunken pilots away from the controls of commercial aviation aircraft.

There does not exist anything remotely like pilot standards for business CEOs or government officials, which is why many businesses and countries have frequent crash landings that kill their passengers and destroy planes and buildings. Sorry to tell you, but many American CEOs and US Presidents should be grounded and their licenses taking away because they are just too dishonest and incompetent and greedy for the job they are in.

The Joss Whedon script for Serenity, where Wash lives, is Serenity-190pages.pdf at www.mediafire.com/folder/1uwh75oa407q8/Firefly

1KIKI

Friday, November 6, 2020 11:56 PM

I recall you bragging that none of your designs ever blew up because of your superiority in creating good systems.

Did you ALSO make sure they were never operated by incompetent people? Or was your superior design skill the difference between a system that might blow up (other designs) and one that wouldn't (yours) - despite your inability to select capable operators?

SIGNYM

Saturday, November 7, 2020 12:04 AM

Quote:
As you can see, SECOND, although some of our Presidents have done SOME good, they have done FAR MORE to continue to develop and expand a system which inexorably funnels money to the wealthiest, and cede control to the economic elites abroad.

Why do you keep pretending this is all "one side's" fault?

We are at a stage when money rules our government, especially at the national and international level.

This isn't a "President" problem, or a "Republican" or "Democrat" problems, or a "Congressional" problem or "media" problem or even a "deep state" problem, this has become a SYSTEMS problem.

Our entire system: our laws and lawmakers, our media, our ethics, our military, our taxes, our spook agencies, our foreign policy establishment, and most of our NGOs ... every aspect of our lives that nudges or compels us to do one thing over another ... is wrapped around the goal of making the rich ... richer.

SO FAR BEYOND MERE POLITICAL PARTIES.

You start being interesting, and then you go off the rails into your private war on the GOP again.

Sigh.

Keep your eye on the ball, m'kay?

SECOND: You called profit a physics problem comparable to gravity. You also called it a systems problem. It is neither. It's a human problem.

Now I launch into an old man hinting at his career as an engineer. When I was designing control systems for petrochemical plants, the difference between a systems problem and a human problem was always the main thing we think about. The human operators of these plants were not created even approximately equal. Some were attentive and others should never be allowed in a control room. Rather than telling you how I handled that problem, let me point you to something far easier for you to understand: How to keep incompetent, dangerous, suicidal, or drunken pilots away from the controls of commercial aviation aircraft.

There does not exist anything remotely like pilot standards for business CEOs or government officials, which is why many businesses and countries have frequent crash landings that kill their passengers and destroy planes and buildings. Sorry to tell you, but many American CEOs and US Presidents should be grounded and their licenses taking away because they are just too dishonest and incompetent and greedy for the job they are in.

So, first you tell me it's a not a systems problem, and then you give me an example of exactly why it IS a systems problem!

When you designed systems, you took into account the possible ineptitude, inattentiveness, greed, or maliciousness of the humans operating it.

So, look at our political and economic systems. Do they take into account the possible ineptitude, inattentiveness, greed, or maliciousness of the humans operating it?

The Founding Fathers did their best to design A POLITICAL SYSTEM of democratic voting, balance of powers, and so forth, to mitigate the worst of human behavior. They discussed among themselves whether a "large system" (federal) was less corruptible or subject to the tyrannies of prejudice than a "small system" (local). They built in protections so the minority wouldn't be subject to a tyranny of the majority, and placed freedom of speech at the top of the list so that thoughts could compete in the "marketplace of ideas", and gun rights second so that tyranny could not be ILLEGALLY enforced. They weren't as stupid as you think, and a political system WAS designed.

An "economic system" developed but not designed, but it COULD be designed by writing the laws using the POLITICAL system ... which is one of the reasons why the economic elite are so focused on controlling the political system (and the media, because democracies are subject to mass changes of opinion). For example, laws could abolish The Fed, or require 100% capitalization of banks, or do away with stock ownership, or require cooperative ownership, or eliminate &

SECOND

Saturday, November 7, 2020 12:11 AM

Quote:
Originally posted by 1KIKI:

I recall you bragging that none of your designs ever blew up because of your superiority in creating good systems.

Did you ALSO make sure they were never operated by incompetent people? Or was your superior design skill the difference between a system that might blow up (other designs) and one that wouldn't (yours) - despite your inability to select capable operators?

My secret: automatic safety shutdown systems that can handle anything less than carefully planned sabotage by either a knowledgeable control room operator or a particularly brilliant maintenance electrician. Lucky for me, knowledgeable and/or brilliant people don't tend to become saboteurs. But most of life is unlike a petrochemical plant. The commonplace sociopath CEO or US President do not face competently designed safety shutdown systems protecting the company or country from maleficence for personal profit.

The Joss Whedon script for Serenity, where Wash lives, is Serenity-190pages.pdf at www.mediafire.com/folder/1uwh75oa407q8/Firefly

SECOND

Saturday, November 7, 2020 12:25 AM

Quote:
Originally posted by SIGNYM:

So, look at our political and economic systems. Do they take into account the possible ineptitude, inattentiveness, greed, or maliciousness of the humans operating it?

The Founding Fathers did their best to design A POLITICAL SYSTEM of democratic voting, balance of powers, and so forth, to mitigate the worst of human behavior. They discussed among themselves whether a "large system" (federal) was less corruptible or subject to the tyrannies of prejudice than a "small system" (local). They built in protections so the minority wouldn't be subject to a tyranny of the majority, and placed freedom of speech at the top of the list so that thoughts could compete in the "marketplace of ideas", and gun rights second so that tyranny could not be ILLEGALLY enforced. They weren't as stupid as you think, and a political system WAS designed.

You are wrong about the 2nd Amendment. Southerners couldn't control their slaves without guns. Historians and Democrats say that the 2nd Amendment was to arm militias to put down slave rebellions. Republicans say that the purpose of the amendment was to give citizens the opportunity to kill tyrannical federal government officials. Since slavery ended, the 2nd has no purpose, according to its original meaning and intentions.

How Slave Owners Dictated the Language of the 2nd Amendment
www.thedailybeast.com/how-slave-owners-dictated-the-language-of-the-2n
d-amendment

The Joss Whedon script for Serenity, where Wash lives, is Serenity-190pages.pdf at www.mediafire.com/folder/1uwh75oa407q8/Firefly

SIGNYM

Saturday, November 7, 2020 1:35 AM

Quote:
SECOND: The commonplace sociopath CEO or US President do not face competently designed safety shutdown systems protecting the company or country from maleficence for personal profit.

Then what system WOULD?

SECOND, I have a lot of ideas, and you, as a design engineer, should be comfortable with spitballing design ideas too. Why are you niggling about trivia like the 2nd Amendment (which BTW according to even your own statement STILL has a purpose today) when the whole scope of politics and economics is open for discussion?

Why do you keep narrowing the scope of thought? You bring up large, universal ideas (like "human nature") and then try to shoehorn it into already-established and clearly-failing legacy systems.

-----------
Pity would be no more,
If we did not MAKE men poor - William Blake

#WEARAMASK

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