Election fallout

POSTED BY: SignyM
UPDATED: Thursday, January 9, 2025 04:34
VIEWED: 11920
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SIGNYM

Thursday, November 5, 2020 4:18 AM

Given that votes are still being counted it's too soon to say in some races what will happen

But overall, Dems didn't manage to push a single Republican from the House, and didn't manage to take the Senate.

There is already fingerpointing and blame-laying within the DCC about these election failures.

Whether Trump or Biden wins, we have a divided government: Dem House, GOP Senate, probable Dem President, and conservative Supreme Court.

Unfortunately there is a lot of unfinished business that won't be completed: investigating the FBI for it's persecution of political rivals for example. And those that remain in Congress are likely to be political establishment hacks of both parties, meaning that only the worst ideas will be sifted thru Congress to land on the President's desk.

If there's going to be any real reform, the only way it's going to happen is if people can manage to come together and push it, item by item.

The offshoring of production

Debt overhang

Endless wars abroad

Health care for all

Environmental remediation

Congress isn't going to tackle any of these unless they're REALLY REALLY pushed.

REAVERFAN

Thursday, November 5, 2020 4:22 AM

Jesus fuck, you can't stop lying, can you? You're RUSSIAN. You don't live here. Your country is not divided. It's just a fascist dictatorship and you're fine with that.

SIGNYM

Thursday, November 5, 2020 5:02 AM

Quote:
Originally posted by reaverfan:
Jesus fuck, you can't stop lying, can you? You're RUSSIAN. You don't live here. Your country is not divided. It's just a fascist dictatorship and you're fine with that.

Prove it.
You can't.

In the meantime, how about those ISSUES? Yanno, the problems that need solving, not your delusions about who you think I am.

WHAT ARE AMERICA'S INTERESTS?

You seem to be allergic to the topic. Are YOU American?

-----------
Pity would be no more,
If we did not MAKE men poor - William Blake

#WEARAMASK

SECOND

Thursday, November 5, 2020 5:27 AM

Quote:
Originally posted by SignyM:

WHAT ARE AMERICA'S INTERESTS?

That no American is homeless or hungry or without healthcare? Many Americans don't have those problems which is why those problems will endure since Democratic and Republican voters have a powerful antipathy toward paying taxes to fix other people's problems. Political speechifying before or after elections will not convince them to change their attitudes about their money.

The Joss Whedon script for Serenity, where Wash lives, is Serenity-190pages.pdf at www.mediafire.com/folder/1uwh75oa407q8/Firefly

THG

Thursday, November 5, 2020 6:02 AM

Quote:
Originally posted by reaverfan:

Jesus fuck, you can't stop lying, can you? You're RUSSIAN. You don't live here. Your country is not divided. It's just a fascist dictatorship and you're fine with that.

Agreed, sig is a russian troll...

T

Stupid people don't know they're stupid, and they certainly don't realize how obvious it is to others.

SIGNYM

Thursday, November 5, 2020 6:54 AM

Quote:
Originally posted by second:
Quote:
Originally posted by SignyM:

WHAT ARE AMERICA'S INTERESTS?
That no American is homeless or hungry or without healthcare? Many Americans don't have those problems which is why those problems will endure since Democratic and Republican voters have a powerful antipathy toward paying taxes to fix other people's problems. Political speechifying before or after elections will not convince them to change their attitudes about their money.

The Joss Whedon script for Serenity, where Wash lives, is Serenity-190pages.pdf at www.mediafire.com/folder/1uwh75oa407q8/Firefly

But here's the thing, SECOND, and I'm glad that you engage in a conversation about issues.

Not everything can OR SHOULD be solved by tax-and-spend.

Why are Americans homeless? Well, part of the problem is that there are a lot of mentally ill and drug addicted people who aren't getting treatment.

OTOH many people have been priced out of the market by rampant speculation. You can't build or spend your way out of that. The only way to fix that is to rein in speculation with higher interest rates and stricter lending standards.

And then the is the problem that there are not enough meaningful jobs at living wages. Thanks to offshoring and automation and illegal immigration there simply aren't enough jobs to go around. (Please note: offshoring,illegal immigration, and automation are profit-driven decisions which the government can modify by policy)

So young people stalled their lives by going to college, which left them saddled with debt and unable to afford buying a home.

Treatment is a tax and spend issue, but other solutions can be found in tariff and investment and trade policies, lending and banking standards, etc. Not everything requires a "sugar daddy" government approach, and if the government shovels more money into a speculative housing bubble it v will probably do what money flowing into any bubble does: make it bigger.

There will always be people who are incapable of working, but rather than treat EVERYONE as a charity case, why not make it possible for people to be able to contribute to their own lives? I think they'd feel a lot better.

I'm not saying this is the only way, or the best way, but this is the best I can come up with. If you think you have better ideas that's great.

-----------
Pity would be no more,
If we did not MAKE men poor - William Blake

#WEARAMASK

SECOND

Thursday, November 5, 2020 7:34 AM

Quote:
Originally posted by SignyM:
Quote:
Originally posted by second:
Quote:
Originally posted by SignyM:

WHAT ARE AMERICA'S INTERESTS?
That no American is homeless or hungry or without healthcare? Many Americans don't have those problems which is why those problems will endure since Democratic and Republican voters have a powerful antipathy toward paying taxes to fix other people's problems. Political speechifying before or after elections will not convince them to change their attitudes about their money.

The Joss Whedon script for Serenity, where Wash lives, is Serenity-190pages.pdf at www.mediafire.com/folder/1uwh75oa407q8/Firefly
But here's the thing, SECOND, and I'm glad that you engage in a conversation about issues.

Not everything can OR SHOULD be solved by tax-and-spend.

Why are Americans homeless? Well, part of the problem is that there are a lot of mentally ill and drug addicted people who aren't getting treatment.

OTOH many people have been priced out of the market by rampant speculation. You can't build or spend your way out of that. The only way to fix that is to rein in speculation with higher interest rates and stricter lending standards.

And then the is the problem that there are not enough meaningful jobs at living wages. Thanks to offshoring and automation and illegal immigration there simply aren't enough jobs to go around. (Please note: offshoring,illegal immigration, and automation are profit-driven decisions which the government can modify by policy)

So young people stalled their lives by going to college, which left them saddled with debt and unable to afford buying a home.

Treatment is a tax and spend issue, but other solutions can be found in tariff and investment and trade policies, lending and banking standards, etc. Not everything requires a "sugar daddy" government approach, and if the government shovels more money into a speculative housing bubble it v will probably do what money flowing into any bubble does: make it bigger.

There will always be people who are incapable of working, but rather than treat EVERYONE as a charity case, why not make it possible for people to be able to contribute to their own lives? I think they'd feel a lot better.

I'm not saying this is the only way, or the best way, but this is the best I can come up with. If you think you have better ideas that's great.

I have the book for you: "The rent is too damn high: what to do about it, and why it matters more than you think"
https://libgen.unblockit.app/search.php?req=rent+is+too+damn+high

The final chapter, Reopening the American Frontier, will give you some ideas. A sample:

Even as urban America revived, the overall national economy has had a bad case of the post-industrial blues.

Contrary to what many people think, this is not a case of Americans no longer building things. Industrial output declines in recessions, but over the long haul neither “offshoring” nor Chinese growth changes the fact that America’s factories churn out more dollars’ worth of products than ever before. What they don’t churn out like they used to is jobs. Across the industrialized world, factory work is increasingly done by fewer people and more machines. The service economy has been, in many ways, a disappointment. We’ve had sluggish productivity growth and stagnant median wages. The economic expansion of the George W. Bush years was the weakest in postwar history before it turned into the worst recession in eighty years.

These problems are multifaceted, and you should be suspicious of anyone pushing a pet theory of everything. But Americans must consider the possibility that decades of ill-considered and inefficient land-use policies are an underrated driver of these trends.

You can read the book. I realize that most people won't. If they did, the idea of building more housing would make them angry because it would reduce the value of their own real estate if housing

SIGNYM

Thursday, November 5, 2020 2:35 PM

Quote:
SIGNYM: WHAT ARE AMERICA'S INTERESTS?

SECOND: That no American is homeless or hungry or without healthcare? Many Americans don't have those problems which is why those problems will endure since Democratic and Republican voters have a powerful antipathy toward paying taxes to fix other people's problems. Political speechifying before or after elections will not convince them to change their attitudes about their money.

SIGNYM: But here's the thing, SECOND, and I'm glad that you engage in a conversation about issues.
Not everything can OR SHOULD be solved by tax-and-spend.
Why are Americans homeless? Well, part of the problem is that there are a lot of mentally ill and drug addicted people who aren't getting treatment.
OTOH many people have been priced out of the market by rampant speculation. You can't build or spend your way out of that. The only way to fix that is to rein in speculation with higher interest rates and stricter lending standards.

And then the is the problem that there are not enough meaningful jobs at living wages. Thanks to offshoring and automation and illegal immigration there simply aren't enough jobs to go around. (Please note: offshoring,illegal immigration, and automation are profit-driven decisions which the government can modify by policy)

So young people stalled their lives by going to college, which left them saddled with debt and unable to afford buying a home.

Treatment is a tax and spend issue, but other solutions can be found in tariff and investment and trade policies, lending and banking standards, etc. Not everything requires a "sugar daddy" government approach, and if the government shovels more money into a speculative housing bubble it v will probably do what money flowing into any bubble does: make it bigger.

There will always be people who are incapable of working, but rather than treat EVERYONE as a charity case, why not make it possible for people to be able to contribute to their own lives? I think they'd feel a lot better.

I'm not saying this is the only way, or the best way, but this is the best I can come up with. If you think you have better ideas that's great.

SECOND: I have the book for you: "The rent is too damn high: what to do about it, and why it matters more than you think"
https://libgen.unblockit.app/search.php?req=rent+is+too+damn+high

The final chapter, Reopening the American Frontier, will give you some ideas. A sample:

Quote:
Even as urban America revived, the overall national economy has had a bad case of the post-industrial blues.

Contrary to what many people think, this is not a case of Americans no longer building things. Industrial output declines in recessions, but over the long haul neither “offshoring” nor Chinese growth changes the fact that America’s factories churn out more dollars’ worth of products than ever before. What they don’t churn out like they used to is jobs. Across the industrialized world, factory work is increasingly done by fewer people and more machines. The service economy has been, in many ways, a disappointment. We’ve had sluggish productivity growth and stagnant median wages. The economic expansion of the George W. Bush years was the weakest in postwar history before it turned into the worst recession in eighty years.

These problems are multifaceted, and you should be suspicious of anyone pushing a pet theory of everything. But Americans must consider the possibility that decades of ill-considered and inefficient land-use policies are an underrated driver of these trends.

Well, as you can see from my initial post, I've already considered automation, in addition to speculation and disability. In fact, I devoted an entire thread to automation.

What drives land use policies? From my observation of local governments and governmen

SECOND

Thursday, November 5, 2020 4:31 PM

Quote:
Originally posted by SIGNYM:

The economy is like a game of cards with ten people sitting at a table. But one player get 1% of the pot, win or lose, with every round. At the end of 100 rounds everyone is out of money except one person, and the game folds. That is the nature of profit- it doesn't return money back into circulation- whether that profit is sucked out of the economy by manufacturing or financialism.

Thomas Piketty wrote an entire book, Capital and ideology, about all the clever and complicated ways societies can go wrong in economic history. Download the free book: https://libgen.unblockit.app/search.php?req=Piketty+Capital+ideology

Piketty is not the kind of person who will simplify things for you, but I am. He is telling governments to NOT allow the greediest citizens to do what they please. Part Two, Slave and Colonial Societies, is full of such stories of greed running free.

I guess Californians don't read Piketty or can't generalize from what they read in order to understand what's happening right in front of them. Look around California at how Uber and Lyft operated and will legally continue to operate. And the ugliest part is that the voters approved it this week: "Big business spent millions to sway Californians’ votes, and received billions in return"
www.marketwatch.com/story/big-business-spent-millions-to-sway-californ
ians-votes-and-received-billions-in-return-11604540224
Voters approved of Uber drivers suffering and Uber stock-owners benefiting from the suffering. Uber understood the ideology of the voters and convinced them it is fair to harm Uber drivers.

The Joss Whedon script for Serenity, where Wash lives, is Serenity-190pages.pdf at www.mediafire.com/folder/1uwh75oa407q8/Firefly

SIGNYM

Thursday, November 5, 2020 11:01 PM

Quote:
SIGNYM:

The economy is like a game of cards with ten people sitting at a table. But one player get 1% of the pot, win or lose, with every round. At the end of 100 rounds everyone is out of money except one person, and the game folds. That is the nature of profit- it doesn't return money back into circulation- whether that profit is sucked out of the economy by manufacturing or financialism.

SECOND: Thomas Piketty wrote an entire book, Capital and ideology, about all the clever and complicated ways societies can go wrong in economic history. Download the free book: https://libgen.unblockit.app/search.php?req=Piketty+Capital+ideology

Piketty is not the kind of person who will simplify things for you, but I am. He is telling governments to NOT allow the greediest citizens to do what they please. Part Two, Slave and Colonial Societies, is full of such stories of greed running free.

I guess Californians don't read Piketty or can't generalize from what they read in order to understand what's happening right in front of them. Look around California at how Uber and Lyft operated and will legally continue to operate. And the ugliest part is that the voters approved it this week: "Big business spent millions to sway Californians’ votes, and received billions in return"
www.marketwatch.com/story/big-business-spent-millions-to-sway-californ
ians-votes-and-received-billions-in-return-11604540224
Voters approved of Uber drivers suffering and Uber stock-owners benefiting from the suffering. Uber understood the ideology of the voters and convinced them it is fair to harm Uber drivers.

Marx wrote a whole THREE BOOKS on the topic, and as far as I can tell Picketty is just rephrasing it for modern audiences. (And Veblen - someone that you previously referenced - wrote about the evils of rentier capitalism.)

So, do you agree that the fundamental problem is a systemic problem of profit, and not a problem of "Republicans" or "Democrats"?

-----------
Pity would be no more,
If we did not MAKE men poor - William Blake

#WEARAMASK

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