Real World Event Discussions
Impeachment Investigation Is Underway, Judiciary Committee Says
POSTED BY: THG
UPDATED: Monday, February 3, 2020 01:19
VIEWED: 84495
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Saturday, October 12, 2019 6:21 AM
1kiki, you are completely out of your mind. Trump gave Turkey the go ahead during a phone call on Sunday for a war on the Kurds, and you can't admit it:
Quote:
Originally posted by 1KIKI:Quote:
Originally posted by 1KIKI:
I think it's more a case of Trump being given a choice by a newly unshackled Erdogan (Turkey out of SWIFT in August): either ramp up US troop levels ASAP and engage in full-on war with Turkey (a NATO member), sacrifice them to superior numbers, or get out of the way.
After Turkey getting out of SWIFT, there are no more whips for the US to use on Turkey.
Quote:Not true SLOPPY. Is the only way you can 'win' an argument is by lying?
Originally posted by SECOND:
1kiki, you said Turkey gave Trump the choice of either "full-on war with Turkey" or Trump moves the American Army out of Turkey's way into Syria.
I said I think SWIFT was the last remaining pressure point on Erdogan. And Turkey leaving SWIFT at the end of August was it slipping the last rein holding it in. I ALSO said that there were FAR WORSE provocations that Turkey could have pressured Trump over since 2016 - a US-backed assassination attempt in 2016, a US-backed coup attempt in 2017, and US sanctions and currency-war that torpedoed the Turkish lira in 2018 and crashed the country's economy. You've left completely unaddressed WHY Turkey would have not used all its options including personal blackmail for any of those FAR WORSE provocations. Yanno, you STRAWMANNED my argument. (ie. lied. again.)
I ALSO said I think Trump was given a courtesy call by Erdogan about Trump's very limited options - a mere 6 weeks after Turkey left SWIFT. And Trump's choices were:
1) Leave your roughly 50 US troops in place and take your chances.
2) Use your roughly 50 troops to fight Turkey, and have them obliterated
3) Get your roughly 50 troops out of the way.
4) Ramp up your entire military for full-on war with Turkey.
Quote:Admitting those were the reasons for withdrawing the US fig-leaf force would have meant Trump admitting that he was out-maneuvered, and basically beaten on the geo-political field. That would have been very embarrassing for Trump.
Trump would have mentioned the threat of "full-on war with Turkey" sometime in the days after that Sunday night phone call from Turkey, if it were true.
He doesn't mind bellowing WAR!! against an already identified target, then backing down. It's harder to bellow WAR!! against a supposed NATO ally.
Quote:Trump has already endured billions in losses, and he's filed for various business bankruptcies 6 times. It's nothing to him.
Trump would NEVER mention that the actual threat was Trump losing his money in Turkey.
UNLIKE YOU, Trump doesn't equate his success with money. What matters is being seen as a 'winner'.
The insane never-Trumpers will be driven even more insane in the wash/rinse/spin/repeat/ cycle they mistake for reality.
The Joss Whedon script for Serenity, where Wash lives, is Serenity-190pages.pdf at www.mediafire.com/folder/1uwh75oa407q8/Firefly
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Saturday, October 12, 2019 6:26 AM
Quote:I'll bite, as long as you provide a quote of the call that says what you claim, a named and valid source for the quote, and a link.
Originally posted by second:
1kiki, you are completely out of your mind. Trump gave Turkey the go ahead during a phone call on Sunday for a war on the Kurds, and you can't admit it:
Otherwise, you get a Buffalo Fire Department (BFD) response.
The insane never-Trumpers will be driven even more insane in the wash/rinse/spin/repeat/ cycle they mistake for reality.
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Saturday, October 12, 2019 6:46 AM
Quote:
Originally posted by SECOND:Quote:You are the craziest Republican I have ever known. Fortunately, at least 3/4 of all Americans would be very angry at Trump if he had cheated on his taxes to the amount of $50 million. Since he says he is worth $10 billion, it is not unlikely he has cheated to the tune of $5 billion. Fifty million or five billion, whichever, would be the end of him as President, even if you still vote for him. But who knows? Maybe he is honest? If he is, why the hell is he fighting so hard to keep secret tax returns that he promised to make public as soon as his audit is complete? LOL, 6ix.
Originally posted by 6IXSTRINGJACK:
I don't give a single fuck if he cheated on his taxes, Second. That's what rich people like you do. Every single one of you. And that's never going to change. If poor people could get away with it too, we all would be doing it.
Do Right, Be Right. :)
The Joss Whedon script for Serenity, where Wash lives, is Serenity-190pages.pdf at www.mediafire.com/folder/1uwh75oa407q8/Firefly
Not a republican.
Not going to pretend to give a shit about tax fraud either.
Do Right, Be Right. :)
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Saturday, October 12, 2019 7:36 AM
Love it love it love it
T 
Trump: I don't know if Giuliani is my lawyer
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Saturday, October 12, 2019 8:33 AM
Does Cooper look extremely creepy, or is it just the fact that he works for the CIA that bothers me when I stare into those cold, dead eyes?
Do Right, Be Right. :)
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Saturday, October 12, 2019 12:32 PM
Quote:
Originally posted by 6IXSTRINGJACK:
Not a republican.
Not going to pretend to give a shit about tax fraud either.
Mostly true.
You're a "Pretend-not-to-be-a-Rethug-so-that-when-it-all-goes-down-I-can-disavow-being-duped Republican."
And you are too dumb or amoral to understand the implications of Trump committing tax fraud, not that you don't care.
If all the rich decide not to pay taxes, good luck calling the fire department when your niece is trapped in a burning building. Good luck calling a cop when your block is overrun by thugs. Good luck flying out of an airport, or driving down a road, or turning on a water main, you stupid fuck.
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Saturday, October 12, 2019 12:37 PM
Quote:SECOND hears voices. They tell him what Trump says, what Trump thinks, and what Trump feels. They whisper in his ear and he believes them. SECOND is
1kiki, you are completely out of your mind. Trump gave Turkey the go ahead during a phone call on Sunday for a war on the Kurds, and you can't admit it
-----------
Pity would be no more,
If we did not MAKE men poor - William Blake
You idiots have been oppressing the entire sexual spectrum as long as you have existed. I can't wait for the day your kind is dead - WISHIMAY
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Saturday, October 12, 2019 1:36 PM
Quote:
Originally posted by SIGNYM:
SECOND hears voices. They tell him what Trump says, what Trump thinks, and what Trump feels. They whisper in his ear and he believes them.
I'd still MUCH RATHER take a flaming helicopter ride with him than stand on the same street for 30 seconds with a total headcase like you
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Saturday, October 12, 2019 1:54 PM
Quote:
Originally posted by WISHIMAY:Quote:
Originally posted by 6IXSTRINGJACK:
Not a republican.
Not going to pretend to give a shit about tax fraud either.
Mostly true.
You're a "Pretend-not-to-be-a-Rethug-so-that-when-it-all-goes-down-I-can-disavow-being-duped Republican."
And you are too dumb or amoral to understand the implications of Trump committing tax fraud, not that you don't care.
If all the rich decide not to pay taxes, good luck calling the fire department when your niece is trapped in a burning building. Good luck calling a cop when your block is overrun by thugs. Good luck flying out of an airport, or driving down a road, or turning on a water main, you stupid fuck.
Long post history here backing up my claims of not being a Republican. They predate the day you accidentally stumbled upon this place. Democrats just became gross since then. Unlike Democrats, however, there isn't a single time in the last 11 years that I've looked back fondly to the GWB years.
There are a lot of posts in the last 3 years that your buddies around here love to post about and say "see, even Republicans don't like Trump."
Well... no shit. That's why I voted for him.
Stop being so hyperbolic about things. Property taxes pay for all of the services that you're talking about. Nobody has figured out a way to get out of paying those. That's not at all what we're talking about here.
Do Right, Be Right. :)
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Saturday, October 12, 2019 5:46 PM
Quote:Jennifer Griffin of Fox News reports that Mr. Trump was supposed to tell Mr. Erdogan to stay north of the border. When the Turkish bully made his threats, Mr. Trump could have said that the U.S. military controls the air above the region and would respond to protect the Kurds and U.S. soldiers. Ms. Griffin reports that Mr. Trump instead “went off script” during the call and agreed to stay out of Turkey’s way.
Originally posted by SIGNYM:Quote:SECOND hears voices. They tell him what Trump says, what Trump thinks, and what Trump feels. They whisper in his ear and he believes them. SECOND is
1kiki, you are completely out of your mind. Trump gave Turkey the go ahead during a phone call on Sunday for a war on the Kurds, and you can't admit it
www.wsj.com/articles/the-turk-and-the-president-11570834334
Trump sympathizers have offered unconvincing justifications for the president’s decision. Two scholars of the Middle East, Michael Doran and Michael A. Reynolds, suggested in the Wall Street Journal that the fault was really President Barack Obama’s for aligning with the Kurds in 2016 — despite the success of that strategy and the lack of any realistic alternatives. Journal columnist Walter Russell Mead rationalized Trump’s move because he is giving his “Jacksonian” (i.e., isolationist) followers what they want. The Jacksonians may get more than they bargained for, however, if Trump’s move leads to a resurgence of the Islamic State.
These attempts to reverse-engineer and thereby justify Trump’s decision fail not only because of the weakness of the arguments advanced on his behalf, but also because there is no reason to imagine that Trump’s move had anything to do with these ex post facto justifications.
We still don’t know why Trump acted so solicitously toward a Turkish dictator who has been pursuing an anti-Israel, anti-American and anti-democratic agenda. Trump himself admitted in 2015 that when it came to Turkey, “I have a little conflict of interest ‘cause I have a major, major building in Istanbul. … It’s called Trump Towers — two towers, instead of one, not the usual one, it’s two.” Might the revenue that Trump derives from the Trump Towers in Istanbul influence his decision to let Erdogan have his way? Trump’s demands that Ukraine and China provide him dirt on Joe Biden indicate that he has no scruples about subordinating public interest to self-interest. Perhaps he did so in this case as well.
Or maybe, just maybe, Trump simply didn’t think much before acting? That would be indicated by his casual dismissal of concerns that the Turkish invasion could lead to the freeing of Islamic State prisoners. “Well, they are going to be escaping to Europe, that’s where they want to go,” Trump said. As if it doesn’t matter whether there are terrorist attacks in Europe, despite all of the Americans living and visiting there — and as if there is no way that a terrorist could get from Europe to the United States.
It would probably be necessary to read the transcripts of Trump’s calls with Erdogan to have any clue about why he acted as he did. Until those become available, there is no need to give much credence to the lame rationales offered by Trump and his amen corner.
www.washingtonpost.com/opinions/2019/10/10/first-trump-betrays-kurds-t
hen-come-justifications/
The Joss Whedon script for Serenity, where Wash lives, is Serenity-190pages.pdf at www.mediafire.com/folder/1uwh75oa407q8/Firefly
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