Real World Event Discussions
A thread for Democrats Only
POSTED BY: THGRRI
UPDATED: Sunday, September 6, 2026 15:36
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Thursday, August 16, 2018 6:46 AM
Quote:Liar.
As you asked for it, Signym, I gave it some thought. I stopped reacting.
And I'll prove it ...
Quote:If you've thought about this, as you SAID you did, then you should be able to answer this question: What do you hope would be accomplished by this policy? After all, there must be a purpose or benefit from proposing such action.
I think that Trump should deport as soon as possible all illegal aliens living long term in America.
I think that you'll evade the question because we both know that yours was a ridiculous proposal to begin with, and if you should try to support it you'll soon walk yourself into a wall.
Quote:But you just said that
I think Trump should shutdown the government if he doesn't get the Texas/Mexico wall authorized by Congress.
Quote:as if border captures were AGAINST your proposal. So, now you WANT him to do what you DIDN'T want him to do a few sentences earlier? Isn't this an example of exactly what I posted? That people often [thoughtlessly] contradict themselves from one post to the other?
Instead, he is concentrating on captures along the border.
Well! you managed to do that in a single post, so congrats!
****
Seriously, SECOND, I imagine you pouting and drinking.
-----------
Pity would be no more,
If we did not MAKE men poor - William Blake
"The messy American environment, where most people don't agree, is perfect for people like me. I CAN DO AS I PLEASE." - SECOND
America is an oligarchy http://www.fireflyfans.net/mthread.aspx?tid=57876
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Thursday, August 16, 2018 8:08 AM
Quote:Signym, why would I want illegal aliens living in America? They are illegal. They should go – to jail, to their home country, whichever the law says. Trump says he wants no illegal aliens living in America. Congratulations to Donald! He and I agree. There were 11 million illegals when he was inaugurated. There are still 11 million. When will he start reducing that number to zero? In what year does he reach zero? Trump has not said. Trump did say he needs a Texas/Mexico wall and he says he will shutdown the government to get that wall. Congratulations again to Donald! He and I agree. I expect him to either get a Congressional appropriation for the wall or else he vetoes the appropriation bill, shutting down the government. That is how a President gets what he wants. There is no third way where he does not get the wall and signs the appropriation bill despite that . . . unless Trump was lying all the time about the Texas/Mexico wall. I disapprove of lying.
Originally posted by SIGNYM:Quote:Liar.
As you asked for it, Signym, I gave it some thought. I stopped reacting.
And I'll prove it ...Quote:If you've thought about this, as you SAID you did, then you should be able to answer this question: What do you hope would be accomplished by this policy? After all, there must be a purpose or benefit from proposing such action.
I think that Trump should deport as soon as possible all illegal aliens living long term in America.
I think that you'll evade the question because we both know that yours was a ridiculous proposal to begin with, and if you should try to support it you'll soon walk yourself into a wall.Quote:But you just said that
I think Trump should shutdown the government if he doesn't get the Texas/Mexico wall authorized by Congress.Quote:as if border captures were AGAINST your proposal. So, now you WANT him to do what you DIDN'T want him to do a few sentences earlier? Isn't this an example of exactly what I posted? That people often [thoughtlessly] contradict themselves from one post to the other?
Instead, he is concentrating on captures along the border.
Well! you managed to do that in a single post, so congrats!
****
Seriously, SECOND, I imagine you pouting and drinking.
Congress might override Trump's veto. Sometimes Presidents lose, but there will be another appropriation bill next year and another chance to add the Texas/Mexico wall to that bill. I expect Trump to be persistent, not give up. Giving up would indicate he was lying all the time about the wall.
The Joss Whedon script for Serenity, where Wash lives, is Serenity-190pages.pdf at www.mediafire.com/folder/1uwh75oa407q8/Firefly
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Thursday, August 16, 2018 12:55 PM
Quote:You said it yourself: They work hard and they're cheap.
Signym, why would I want illegal aliens living in America?
Quote:Why? I know MY issues with illegal immigrants, and it has nothing to do with "brown". So, aside from what Trump says, what'r YOUR reason for not wanting 11 million illegal immigrants in the USA? Stop using Trump as your sockpuppet. Speak for yourself, man! Show us that you've done some thinking!
They are illegal. They should go – to jail, to their home country, whichever the law says.
-----------
Pity would be no more,
If we did not MAKE men poor - William Blake
"The messy American environment, where most people don't agree, is perfect for people like me. I CAN DO AS I PLEASE." - SECOND
America is an oligarchy http://www.fireflyfans.net/mthread.aspx?tid=57876
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Thursday, August 16, 2018 4:04 PM
Quote:Congress passed laws defining who is illegal. In my opinion, these are perfectly reasonable laws. I have no desire to rewrite these laws. The laws weren't enforced perfectly by Obama because the laws required deportees to go before a judge and there were not enough judges. Trump also is required to send the deportees to a judge, but does not want to do that.
Originally posted by SIGNYM:Quote:You said it yourself: They work hard and they're cheap.
Signym, why would I want illegal aliens living in America?Quote:Why? I know MY issues with illegal immigrants, and it has nothing to do with "brown". So, aside from what Trump says, what'r YOUR reason for not wanting 11 million illegal immigrants in the USA? Stop using Trump as your sockpuppet. Speak for yourself, man! Show us that you've done some thinking!
They are illegal. They should go – to jail, to their home country, whichever the law says.
-----------
Pity would be no more,
If we did not MAKE men poor - William Blake
"The messy American environment, where most people don't agree, is perfect for people like me. I CAN DO AS I PLEASE." - SECOND
There is an article explaining the steps that Trump refuses to take, steps required by law:
Fact Checker Analysis
President Trump’s misconceptions about immigration courts and law
www.washingtonpost.com/news/fact-checker/wp/2018/06/26/president-trump
s-misconceptions-about-immigration-courts-and-law/?utm_term=.211957f78f07
“Hiring many thousands of judges, and going through a long and complicated legal process, is not the way to go – will always be disfunctional. People must simply be stopped at the Border and told they cannot come into the U.S. illegally. Children brought back to their country…… ….If this is done, illegal immigration will be stopped in it’s tracks – and at very little, by comparison, cost. This is the only real answer – and we must continue to BUILD THE WALL!”
— Trump, in a pair of tweets, June 25, 2018
I don't know what game Trump is playing. Maybe he is simply pandering to his base when he talks about illegals. Maybe he does not want to reduce the number of illegal aliens from 11 million down to zero, but he can't say it to his base. Whatever his game is, he is not doing the work necessary by law to deport those 11 million.
The Joss Whedon script for Serenity, where Wash lives, is Serenity-190pages.pdf at www.mediafire.com/folder/1uwh75oa407q8/Firefly
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Thursday, August 16, 2018 5:24 PM
Quote:There is an assumption that the 2020 presidential election will be business as usual: Donald Trump will run on the economy, social issues and immigration, and the Democratic candidate will run on income inequality, Democratic socialism and Trump’s character — the 2020 version of right-left U.S. politics.
Originally posted by SIGNYM:
I'm just going to make a general comment here ...
It seems to me that I spend a lot of posts repeating the same things over and over. I have a general understanding of what I think is good for Americans and how I think we can get there. It's certainly not 100% correct, but at least I took some time to think it through to its fundamental principles ... what am I "for" more? Corporations or democracy? Foreign money or peace? Efficiency or robustness? Globalism or nationalism? Meritocracy or privilege?
Many of you OTOH just endlessly splatter the board with undigested, contradictory bits and pieces of ghafla. As soon as one of your (mostly) stupid points is dispatched, you bring up another (mostly) stupid point. Quite often, you'll recycle a (mostly) stupid point from a previous post without, apparently, even realizing that that point has already been eliminated several times by some of your other (mostly) stupid posts.
It would be nice if you would, some day, sit down and THINK. Yanno, track down what you feel, and - especially - WHY you feel that way. What or who are you defending? Why?
"The messy American environment, where most people don't agree, is perfect for people like me. I CAN DO AS I PLEASE." - SECOND
But I believe there’s a sleeper issue out there that could force its way into the election. What if Mother Nature is on the ballot?
What if all the extreme weather this year — linked to climate change — gets even worse and more costly? What if the big 2020 issue is not left-right — but hot-cold or wet-dry? What if the big 2020 issue is not “Who lost Russia?” or “Who lost North Korea?” but “Who lost planet Earth?”
If in 2020 we’re in the midst of even more damaging droughts and storms than we are today, Democrats may be able to run against Trump’s make-America-polluted-again environmental strategy and his refusal to either acknowledge the threat of climate change or seize the incredible opportunity it offers America to become richer, healthier, more secure and more respected by leading the world in clean energy technologies.
More at www.registerguard.com/opinion/20180816/democrats-should-put-mother-nat
ure-on-2020-ballot
The Joss Whedon script for Serenity, where Wash lives, is Serenity-190pages.pdf at www.mediafire.com/folder/1uwh75oa407q8/Firefly
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Thursday, August 16, 2018 8:22 PM
Quote:What aspect is "reasonable"? Is it the limits and allowances on immigration? The kinds of visas available? The deportation process? What kinds of laws would be "UNreasonable"?
Congress passed laws defining who is illegal. In my opinion, these are perfectly reasonable laws.
What is it about the presence of so many "illegal aliens" that's the problem? Is it an economic one? A cultural one? Or are you simply objecting to the fact that the first thing that these immigrants did is to break our border laws? If THAT's the basic issue, what is it about the presence of these lawbreakers that you find troubling? After all, every American has broken the speeding limit and not gotten caught ... how is that different from this? Do you feel that they represent a large population which has no allegiance to the USA or fundamental respect for our laws? Do you feel that indicates basic criminality which presages further criminality? In other words, what SPECIFICALLY is your problem with the presence of so many illegal aliens living here?
-----------
Pity would be no more,
If we did not MAKE men poor - William Blake
"The messy American environment, where most people don't agree, is perfect for people like me. I CAN DO AS I PLEASE." - SECOND
America is an oligarchy http://www.fireflyfans.net/mthread.aspx?tid=57876
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Thursday, August 16, 2018 9:03 PM
Quote:You have a lot of questions for me (but this is not about me) and no answers for why Trump is not enforcing the law. Have somebody (but not me) explain to you why Trump concentrates all his speeches on preventing illegals from crossing the border, but at the same time the actual number of illegals living in America stays at 11 million.
Originally posted by SIGNYM:Quote:What aspect is "reasonable"? Is it the limits and allowances on immigration? The kinds of visas available? The deportation process? What kinds of laws would be "UNreasonable"?
Congress passed laws defining who is illegal. In my opinion, these are perfectly reasonable laws.
What is it about the presence of so many "illegal aliens" that's the problem? Is it an economic one? A cultural one? Or are you simply objecting to the fact that the first thing that these immigrants did is to break our border laws? If THAT's the basic issue, what is it about the presence of these lawbreakers that you find troubling? After all, every American has broken the speeding limit and not gotten caught ... how is that different from this? Do you feel that they represent a large population which has no allegiance to the USA or fundamental respect for our laws? Do you feel that indicates basic criminality which presages further criminality? In other words, what SPECIFICALLY is your problem with the presence of so many illegal aliens living here?
"The messy American environment, where most people don't agree, is perfect for people like me. I CAN DO AS I PLEASE." - SECOND
On one hand, a few thousand illegals are caught at the border each month and on the other hand a few dozen illegals are deported out of 11 million illegals that have been living in America for years. Trump is not enforcing the law and it is his responsibility to explain why he does not concentrate on the bigger problem, size 11 million. Trump has not explained. I can't. I have no idea why he is spinning his wheels.
I recall that MS-13 are Trump's favorite boogie men among illegals. Why has he not deported them? Breitbart blames the Democrats, but it would be Trump's lack of effort that should take the blame.
www.breitbart.com/big-government/2018/05/17/11-animalistic-crimes-comm
itted-against-americans-by-ms-13-gang/
The Joss Whedon script for Serenity, where Wash lives, is Serenity-190pages.pdf at www.mediafire.com/folder/1uwh75oa407q8/Firefly
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Thursday, August 16, 2018 9:15 PM
Quote:Yes, because this was all about YOU THINKING.
You have a lot of questions for me- SECOND
Now, you SAID that you gave this issue some thought. And since you obviously haven't thought about it at all and were just making snarky proposals, you walked yourself into a wall after just a few questions, as predicted. You're just a puppet with strings attached, and all anyone has to do is pull the right strings and you'll react. I've said that your opinions are SECONDHAND and was right.
If at some point you want to stop splattering the board with random bits of undigested schiess, and are ready for an honest discussion, let me know.
-----------
Pity would be no more,
If we did not MAKE men poor - William Blake
"The messy American environment, where most people don't agree, is perfect for people like me. I CAN DO AS I PLEASE." - SECOND
America is an oligarchy http://www.fireflyfans.net/mthread.aspx?tid=57876
NOTIFY: Y | REPLY | REPLY WITH QUOTE | PERMALINK | TOP | HOME
Thursday, August 16, 2018 9:58 PM
Quote:Signym, why is it unimportant to you that Trump is not deporting MS-13? He could do it with an executive order, but he has not. Then there are the other 11 million illegals who aren't murdering Americans. Trump promised to remove them, too. But he also said he wasn't going to spend any money to do it. Quoting him:
Originally posted by SIGNYM:Quote:Yes, because this was all about YOU THINKING.
You have a lot of questions for me- SECOND
Now, you SAID that you gave this issue some thought. And since you obviously haven't thought about it at all and were just making snarky proposals, you walked yourself into a wall after just a few questions, as predicted. You're just a puppet with strings attached, and all anyone has to do is pull the right strings and you'll react. I've said that your opinions are SECONDHAND and was right.
If at some point you want to stop splattering the board with random bits of undigested schiess, and are ready for an honest discussion, let me know.
"The messy American environment, where most people don't agree, is perfect for people like me. I CAN DO AS I PLEASE." - SECOND
Quote:— Trump, in a pair of tweets, June 25, 2018
“Hiring many thousands of judges, and going through a long and complicated legal process, is not the way to go – will always be disfunctional. People must simply be stopped at the Border and told they cannot come into the U.S. illegally. Children brought back to their country…… ….If this is done, illegal immigration will be stopped in it’s tracks – and at very little, by comparison, cost. This is the only real answer – and we must continue to BUILD THE WALL!”
www.washingtonpost.com/news/fact-checker/wp/2018/06/26/president-trump
s-misconceptions-about-immigration-courts-and-law/?utm_term=.07c0190492c7
Trump cannot deport illegals unless he spends money and follows the law. He refuses to do either of those things. Signym, I think that is a White House/Trump problem you need to explain. And Trump's preferred solution, build the wall, won't be built unless Trump vetoes the appropriations bill in September, forcing Congress to add the wall money to the bill to get his signature.
If I was betting, I'd bet that Trump won't veto the spending bill and he won't get his wall because of that. As Trump says far too often: We will see.
The Joss Whedon script for Serenity, where Wash lives, is Serenity-190pages.pdf at www.mediafire.com/folder/1uwh75oa407q8/Firefly
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Friday, August 17, 2018 12:38 AM
Quote:Do you really think you're going to bait me into an argument by making such a ridiculous statement?
Signym, why is it unimportant to you that Trump is not deporting MS-13?
Quote:
NPR: Trump's ICE Deportations Are Up From Obama's Figures, Data Show
https://www.npr.org/2018/01/23/579884642/trumps-ice-deportations-incre
ase-from-obamas-figures-data-show
But let me ask YOU: Why is it unimportant to you that you're such a mindless partisan?
When you're ready not be such a tool, let me know.
-----------
Pity would be no more,
If we did not MAKE men poor - William Blake
"The messy American environment, where most people don't agree, is perfect for people like me. I CAN DO AS I PLEASE." - SECOND
America is an oligarchy http://www.fireflyfans.net/mthread.aspx?tid=57876
NOTIFY: Y | REPLY | REPLY WITH QUOTE | PERMALINK | TOP | HOME