Anti Intellectualism is Killing America
POSTED BY: Magonsdaughter
UPDATED: Monday, July 13, 2026 01:26
VIEWED: 26774
PAGE 19 of 21
Quote:
Originally posted by SIGNYM:
First of all, it DOES matter. For many children (and adults) for whom reading is difficult, they NEVER learn how to read, or never learn how to read WELL. IF you're spending your reading time picking through the vagaries of spelling, simply trying to identify the words ... how much of the content do you think you're going to get? How much do you think that person will be reading? Will they ever read for pleasure? Or will their difficulty with reading will be a LIFELONG BARRIER to knowledge?
And for those that DO learn how to read, the hours, days, weeks, months, and years spent on learning that particular information, what about all of the time they could have spent on OTHER things, like mapping (in our DD's case) or arithmetic?
We're coming at it from different perpectives, you are talking about the personal and I am about the global. Sorry that probably made me sound like an arsehole, which wasn't intended. I didn't mean to say that the struggle doesn't matter to the individual, but it doesn't impact on rates of literacy.
Regarding immigrants, Melbourne is a city of immigrants. We have had waves of new arrivals over the years. Immigrants, or at least children of immigrant families, consistently top the scores in both school and the university system. One of the most delightful experiences I had was graduating as an adult and being amongst this sea of diversity, African, Asian cultures with their large and proud families.
So I'm not seeing a shocking illiteracy amongst immigrants. Granted the first generation may struggle, but they would probably do so anyway regardless of a phonetic alphabet.
I really feel like I have spent enough airspace on this topic, once again a thread hijacked by our resident spelling zealot. Of all the ideas for change in this world, for making it a better place, this one seems small and paltry and ineffective. Not worth the airspace.
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MAGONS, I agree that phonetic English isn't a world-shattering idea. Nonetheless, it would still be a useful tool for making ENGLISH literacy easier. I work with immigrants for whom English is a third or fourth language, and they all say that learning English spelling is difficult. YOUR immigrants sound like the sons and daughters of the wealthy, who can afford to spend a lot of time and effort on something other than working for a living. For the many poor - especially women- easier English may mean an easier pathway to learning.
So what I'm talking about is global, not personal, and you have not changed my mind.
OTOH, you're right, this discussion has been threadjacked. I'm ready to move off the topic pf phonetics.
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You can't build a nation with bombs. You can't create a society with guns.
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Quote:
Originally posted by Magonsdaughter:
We're coming at it from different perpectives, you are talking about the personal and I am about the global. Sorry that probably made me sound like an arsehole, which wasn't intended. I didn't mean to say that the struggle doesn't matter to the individual, but it doesn't impact on rates of literacy.
Your perspectiv iz dependent on not thinking.
If it takes 1 person a year to do sumthing that shoud take a few weeks, thats 26 x the cost. Multiply that by everybody who iz doing it.
Thats the educational part uv the trillion$ per yir English iz costing the world.
Your perspectiv also iz dependent on ignoring everything Sig & I hav ritten.
Sooooo.... wuts the topic title agen?
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DUZ XaT SEM RiT TQ YQ? - Jubal Early
http://www.nooalf.com
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Quote:
Originally posted by SIGNYM:
MAGONS, I agree that phonetic English isn't a world-shattering idea. Nonetheless, it would still be a useful tool for making ENGLISH literacy easier. I work with immigrants for whom English is a third or fourth language, and they all say that learning English spelling is difficult. YOUR immigrants sound like the sons and daughters of the wealthy, who can afford to spend a lot of time and effort on something other than working for a living. For the many poor - especially women- easier English may mean an easier pathway to learning.
So what I'm talking about is global, not personal, and you have not changed my mind.
OTOH, you're right, this discussion has been threadjacked. I'm ready to move off the topic pf phonetics.
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You can't build a nation with bombs. You can't create a society with guns.
happy not to talk about phonetics, but the migrants aren't necessarily wealthy - just your hard working, sacrifice everything for the kids education kind....
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Quote:
Deakin University anthropologist Rohan Bastin suggests anti-intellectualism in Australia "is a result of a value we hold very dear: a deep sense of equality. But how can a racist be egalitarian? Well, it's easy when they confuse equality with sameness and immediately create an in-group."
In other words, our famed egalitarianism relies on assimilation, a flattening out of identity and a failure to recognise, value or simply cope with difference. Professor Bastin says anybody "who refuses to assimilate for reasons of their history of suffering at our hands or because they subscribe to their own sense of identity and, within that, their own concepts of equality," is on the outer.
This for me is the crux of Australian anti intellectualism. I wonder if it has a different cause in the US.
As much as I love the idea that egalitarianism is a core value, I see that it's got a flip side that strangely unpleasant. It really is about 'everyone is equal as long as you follow the same team. If anyone complains about unfair treatment, or points out prejudice http://mashable.com/2015/08/04/adam-goodes-speaks-out/ then they are a whinger or a sook.
If you do too well, or are too smart and know it, people will try to take you down a peg. The fact that we have expressions such as 'take down a peg' and 'tall poppy syndrome' (you cut the heads off the tall growing poppies) says a lot about our beliefs. Now I'm uncomfortable with some of the more recent changes - talking yourself up or bragging about your achievements - but I also think that we shouldn't only value the ordinary, 'the mums and dads of australia' white, suburban dwelling, two cars and a caravan, football watching, cat, dog, two point five kids. And anything else is at worst a threat and at best dismissed.
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YOU are the crux uv Australian anti-intelectualizm!!!!!!!!!
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DUZ XaT SEM RiT TQ YQ? - Jubal Early
http://www.nooalf.com
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Sorry.
I apolojize for my insulting outburst. You are not the crux. You are not a crux uv anything. Who wants to be a crux? Thats just gross. No more name calling from me. You are completely within your rites to disagree with me wether you hav a reazon or not.
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DUZ XaT SEM RiT TQ YQ? - Jubal Early
http://www.nooalf.com
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This for me is the crux of Australian anti intellectualism. I wonder if it has a different cause in the US.
I very definitely get a flavor of what you're saying. It's a kind of affable, lowest-common-denominator friendliness to everyone who conforms. A 'we're all just blokes' attitude. (I hope I'm understanding it, and not misusing your English too terribly.)
I think in the US it's a lot more brutal and unforgiving. It's EXTREMELY racial. It's EXTREMELY sexist. It's EXTREMELY religious. It's EXTREMELY hate-filled. People who don't or can't conform because of skin color, sex, accent, intellect or talent aren't merely excluded, they're targeted. There's a reason a lot of conservatives viscerally hate Obama that has nothing to do with his political party, or his actions in office.
But I THINK it has the same social function, which is to define a group of people who are to be relatively privileged. I think whenever there is bias, it has to do with making up reasons why the haves should have, and the have-nots should be without. Maybe the original defining haves determine the characteristics of the group, leading to different profiles of haves around the globe due to purely historical reasons. But I think it's the same function.
So to address your question, I think it's superficially different, but essentially the same.
BTW, I find it interesting that people who denigrate the 'out' groups the most are also the same ones who truly don't seem to believe in equal opportunity. You'd think that if they truly believed in their own innate superiority they'd have nothing to fear from everyone having equal education, equal employment based on their abilities, and equal status and recognition based on their contributions.
SAGAN: We are releasing vast quantities of carbon dioxide, increasing the greenhouse effect. It may not take much to destabilize the Earth's climate, to convert this heaven, our only home in the cosmos, into a kind of hell.
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Brutal iz the rite word for it. Just look at the size uv our prizon population. Its like the system iz set up az an obstacle course - so many wayz to fall down and so hard to get up agen.
The anti-intellectual aspect iz sumthing TPTB rely on to keep everybody down. Note how quickly they commandeered the Tea Party movement and uzed it to thwart Obama. It wuz no accident that the politicianz that rode that wave into office were all chowderhed wackoz.
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DUZ XaT SEM RiT TQ YQ? - Jubal Early
http://www.nooalf.com
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I didn't realize there was a strain of anti-intellectualism in Australia, altho I did notice that a lot of men are sports fanatics and drink beer.
OOC, MAGONS, is anti-intellectualism as prevalent in women?
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You can't build a nation with bombs. You can't create a society with guns.
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