Piracy and My Favorite Show: Firefly
POSTED BY: EndangeredMassa
UPDATED: Wednesday, May 18, 2005 02:42
VIEWED: 14042
PAGE 5 of 8
I went to school from 1999 - 2003. There were easy ways to download plenty of media.
For instance I had every episode of Firefly downloaded. Was it wrong? Yep. The reason I don't feel bad about it was that there was no other option available to obtain the episodes. I've bought 3 box sets of Firefly since. Have I ever downloaded a theatrical release movie? Nope. I could get those by legal means. That's where my line is. Doesn't make it the same as what's morally or legally right.
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I think that's a good line, Zeek.
Perhaps that's my real problem with piracy. Pirates aren't selling something that you can't get anywhere else at any price -- rather, they're stealing something and selling it cheap. They're sneaking money out of the pockets of folks who created the now stolen product.
I never downloaded the eps before the DVD. Why? Because I don't trust pirates or their motives. How could I trust someone who created an illegal file which deliberately flaunts property laws?
If they'll do that, what are they hiding inside that data stream? What am I downloading into my computer besides video and audio?
There's my problem with pirates. If your video or music is available commercially, there's no justification for paying someone who is selling you a stolen product.
"I'm gonna rip you a new puppet hole, bitch!"
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Well, let me put it this way. Universal have invested (well over) $40,000,000 of cash into this movie. For fans, they have been running test screenings so they can see the movie early.
Any fan filming the movie so Asian pirates can put in on DVD 5 months early for sale as a crap unfinished cam copy....
Anybody failing to see how that is a PISS POOR way to pay back Universal for the support they have shown Joss, when nobody else would, is missing a screw.
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Quote:
Originally posted by AnthonyT:
"No actually. Actors, etc typically get what is known as a "buy out." This means that they get no residules, nor royalties, nor any other payment besides there original paycheck. This cuts down on the costs for the producer as they now don't need the administrative infrastructure to keep track of such things for all time, etc."
Typically they get a buy out? But not always? Which is the case here? Do you even know?
It is the standard. So, I may assume with confidence that it is true.
Quote:
Originally posted by AnthonyT:
"And even if they did, the money would be neglegable. As a parallel, in the music industry, ask any artist. They earn next to nothing on the album sales, that is where the producer earns there money. The artist earns there money on concert ticket/merchandise/etc sales."
So, only the producer gets less money. Well, the actors might get less money, but the less money they get is inconsequential.
If you had a point here, I can't extract it.
Quote:
Originally posted by AnthonyT:
"Actually, no it isn't. Stealing by definition is taking was does not belong to you. Please note the taking. This means that once I take it, you no longer have it. Thus downloading is not stealing.
If you want to use an actual correct term, you might use, unauthorised copying."
So you're only guilty of copyright infringement, sort of like patent infringement, right?
Again, in which country. *sigh* You just don't get that the US's laws are not the standard. You just don't get the intricate subtleties of this situation.
Quote:
Originally posted by AnthonyT:
"But then again, as I've asked before, what country are you in. Downloading is legal in some countries as it some countries only control unauthorised distribution, and downloading is not distributing. Uploading on the other hand is distributing."
Murder is legal in some countries. And of course you couldn't download if no one uploaded. So you're supporting an illegal practice that might be taking money from actors and is definitely taking it from producers, yeah?
Apples and oranges. You cannot compare downloading to murdur. Your point there is moot.
Also, refer to country and subtle remarks above.
Quote:
Originally posted by AnthonyT:
My problem is that you don't have the straightforwardness to admit that it's illegal and that it is technically wrong.
It is illegal in your view, from your country. As soon as you admit that there are other countries in the world with different laws the better. Your country is not the standard nor is your "morality."
Quote:
Originally posted by AnthonyT:
I just don't feel bad about it and don't think it makes me likely to steal anyone's household valuables.
This we can agree on.
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"Canada being mad at you is like Mr. Rogers throwing a brick through your window." -Jon Stewart, The Daily Show
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Quote:
Originally posted by reaverdeli:
As for stealing and piracy not being the same, lets educate ourselves.
Let's.
Quote:
Originally posted by reaverdeli:
Read below and see the first definition. Now, what is property? (see the second definition below) Well, it can be a physical thing. A movie is a physical thing, right?
Actually no. The movie is something that is on a physical medium. The DVD is a physical thing. It just happens to contain a movie.
Quote:
Originally posted by reaverdeli:
A file on a computer is a physical thing, right?
Similarly, a file on a computer is not a physical thing. A file on a computer is a certain arrangment of 0's and 1's on a physical thing called a hdd (or tape or zip or...). Depending on what filesystem is being used, how it is being stored, etc, it can be any number of different combinations of 0's and 1's.
I could go on as to how you are wrong that a file is a physical thing, but I'll just state that the file is not physical, the hdd is (or tape or zip or...).
Quote:
Originally posted by reaverdeli:
But have you heard of intellectual property? That is an idea. You know people can steal ideas, right? That is why they also copyright and Trade Mark these things.
There we go with using the term stealing again.
FOR ME TO TAKE SOMETHING FROM YOU, I MUST ACTUALLY TAKE IT FROM YOU. AS IN YOU NO LONGER HAVE IT. ARE YOU GETTING THAT YET?
You have clearly tread in a domain in which you are ill equiped to argue. Please leave this to those of us that actually know something about the technology used.
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"Canada being mad at you is like Mr. Rogers throwing a brick through your window." -Jon Stewart, The Daily Show
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Quote:
Originally posted by SimonWho:
Like it or lump it, pirating is illegal and the mass release of the movie on newsgroups/file sharing will damage the box office.
Please see my previous posts.
Quote:
Originally posted by SimonWho:
However, there are the occasional grey areas:
Holy crap! Someone admitted that this is a grey area!!!
Quote:
Originally posted by SimonWho:
Something that certainly could not be said for the cinematic release of Serenity.
I haven't read one post that stated any intention (implied or not) to download Serenity. In fact, everyone has stated that they're going to see it along with many that they bring with them. So, why you are stating this is beyond me.
Quote:
Originally posted by SimonWho:
Just because you could steal candy from a baby and no-one would know, that doesn't make it any the less wrong.
You comparision is moot.
----
"Canada being mad at you is like Mr. Rogers throwing a brick through your window." -Jon Stewart, The Daily Show
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Quote:
Originally posted by Cerenity:
And if you care anything at all about what you are watching (and let’s face it, you do or else you wouldn’t waste your time) wouldn’t you want to support that endeavor?
Please read my previous posts.
There are many ways in which we can support an endeavour.
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"Canada being mad at you is like Mr. Rogers throwing a brick through your window." -Jon Stewart, The Daily Show
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Quote:
Originally posted by Cedric:
I used to pirate music and videos indiscriminately. I gave myself a lot of excuses: I was a poor college student; I wasn't *really* taking anything; no one was suffering because of what I did.
Then I made my first album as an indie musician.
Not to shit on you, but seriously, how can you say as an indie, that the downloading of music is effecting you to any large extent.
That's like saying if I wrote some program and charged $10 bucks for it and I didn't earn my time back that people are pirating my program and thus piracy is a huge problem and the reason why I'm not getting the money I deserve.
Seriously
Quote:
Originally posted by Cedric:
Whether we get a second Firefly movie, or even a new series, will depend on the success of the first movie, both at the box office and on DVD.
[snip]
So let's make this abundantly clear. Joss and all of our BDH's do the job, and they get paid. And we're the ones who pay them.
I don't think anyone here has stated (or implied) differently.
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"Canada being mad at you is like Mr. Rogers throwing a brick through your window." -Jon Stewart, The Daily Show
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Quote:
Originally posted by xenocide:
Well, I don't know about this personally, again downloading films is too much work, but I know people who have downloaded films, especially big effects films that they had to see in the theatre. In music, I know I personally have bought albums I never would have bought if I had not downloaded a song I liked.
Indeed! I remember reports when that whole fiasco began (thank you very much Lars...
) that sales actually increased... after Lars, not so much.I think I would be time to mention though that these industries have shouted that that the sky is falling many times before. Remember when recordable Beta/VHS/CD/DVD/etc came out? Remember when the industries said that this would be the end of them, etc b/c of this? Well it's been some time and they're still around and thriving. So, much for that.
And for those that don't think that anyone is paying for people that download stuff. Perhaps you should look into the taxes that are on writtable media. There is a specific one that all that money goes to the entertainment industry b/c of the possibility of people downloading stuff, etc. So, whether you like it or not, those people are paying something for it.
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"Canada being mad at you is like Mr. Rogers throwing a brick through your window." -Jon Stewart, The Daily Show
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Quote:
Originally posted by SigmaNunki:
I haven't read one post that stated any intention (implied or not) to download Serenity. In fact, everyone has stated that they're going to see it along with many that they bring with them. So, why you are stating this is beyond me.
Quote:
Originally posted by Zeek:
If anyone pirates this movie I'll personally never forgive them. Then I'll download it cause I really really wanna see it again and again. Which I doubt will stop me from going again and again when the movie hits theaters.
So, you're just not reading. I think I've found the problem.
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