The Last Jedi
POSTED BY: SHINYGOODGUY
UPDATED: Thursday, February 1, 2018 14:14
VIEWED: 8097
PAGE 2 of 3
Quote:I am going wondering how the first reviews were positive. Did fans already have their decision before even seeing the film?
Originally posted by SHINYGOODGUY:Quote:No, definitely not a Lucas script, but I got the feeling, as I stated, that the edits were a bit off. As for the rest, looking back, it did seem a bit Jekyll & Hyde, peek-a-boo-ish.
Originally posted by JEWELSTAITEFAN:
This Episode VIII certainly did not feel like a Lucas script or story. Several others agreed with me on that point.
I feel Rogue One was better, and a more fulfilling representative of the Star Wars franchise. Not sure why Johnson was selected to direct, but glad he turned down Episode 9.
Yes, somebody behind me was snoring during the show. I realized they weren't missing a whole lot. I did like it better than TFA.
At some point I'm wondering if this is the fate that awaits us in future films. Dawning on me that the script seemed the work of ADHD writer, or perhaps it was specifically targeted for short attention span audience.
There were parts I loved and wouldn't trade for the world; they were so good, so Star Wars, dripping with nostalgia - and just the right amount. But then he would spoil it by doing something quite awkward and counter-productive in terms of the Star Wars mythos. For example, the treatment of Luke Skywalker. I'm not sure what to make of it, although I do get the feeling that Disney wants to go in a different
direction. But some of Johnson's choices were head scratchers. Like I said, I'm not sure what to make of it. It seemed a bit uneven.
When I left the theater, I was busy absorbing what I just saw; and so were many within the movie theater. At the end of TFA, people were smiling, applauding and somewhat excited at what they just saw. With TLJ it wasn't apparent to me that people were excited at what they just witnessed. Since then, I have watched review after review, some good, some bad and some awful, and yet others that felt as I did - somewhat confused as to what to make of all of it. I'm thinking and going back to see it again and see if I still feel the same way.
Somehow I think this is what the brain trust at Disney wanted. I think I will start another thread to discuss, for those that have seen it. There's much to discuss.
SGG
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Quote:
I am going wondering how the first reviews were positive. Did fans already have their decision before even seeing the film?
In answer to your question above: I don't know.
The problem as I see it, is not so much what fans expect, but rather the continuation of the Saga. It has to make sense. I understand that Disney wants to take it in a new direction, but it still needs to make sense if they want the fans, both old and new, to follow just as fervently as the OGs. The original Star Wars fans.
For example: As I sated before, the treatment of Luke as a character. That should have been handled differently. Why would Disney approve of Luke looking to kill Kylo, and in his sleep for crying out loud. That is not who he is.
Why? Remember back in ROTJ how he refused to give in to the Dark side of the Force and threw his lightsaber away instead of killing his father. He felt the good in him. He defied the Emperor. It just doesn't follow that he would look to kill Kylo, despite the fact that he was evil. A Jedi never attacks!
That death was against everything Luke had come to learn about using the Force.
SGG
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lol Vox.
https://www.vox.com/culture/2017/12/18/16791844/star-wars-last-jedi-ba
cklash-controversy
Do Right, Be Right. :)
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After seeing Star Wars in 1977 I did want to see more films from Lucas.
At this point I hope Johnson doesn't make anymore, and likely the same for Trevorrow.
I take it Abrams is helming Episode 9. Will the whole film take place on Earth?
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bump^
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Quote:I feel like much of this is being walked back, in the discussion thread.
Originally posted by SHINYGOODGUY:
NO SPOILERS.....NO SPOILERS.....NO SPOILERS.....NO SPOILERS.....NO SPOILERS
I purposely did not read any reviews or watch all the trailers, just so that I could go in and totally immerse myself in the fantasy. There are parts that I really loved and some that I didn't, but overall I liked it.
First, a movie that had humor and some continuity. Although I wasn't too thrilled with some of the edits and jump cuts, but it did have pacing and overall movement much like the early trilogy. I felt that Director Johnson got a little too enamored of the melodrama, but he would intersperse humor, and so that would bring the pace back into play. Somehow I felt that Johnson overused the intercut between scenes which threatened to rob the movie of it's established pace (some establishment is a good thing).
The story, although somewhat involved, followed a logical pattern and accounted for itself well. Second, a movie that spoke of the past but only as a way to honor it. But this movie was about transition, both about the characters within the movie, as well as, the franchise itself. I got the feeling that Disney is looking for a way to transform the franchise and develop a new Jedi order. Perhaps even to recruit new members with Finn and Rey leading the way. And even perhaps the newest character Rose.
But I did like it. I liked the treatment of the overall story, funny, drama-filled when needed but always adventurous. The Last Jedi came the closest to the feeling I had to the original 3 episodes. I got the feeling that I had in TESB, the second and, to everyone's mind, the best of the whole lot. The one where we find out about Luke's father. We all waited patiently for that moment, that game-changer moment when we would find out about Rey's parents. NO SPOILERS HERE.....SORRY! You'll have to see the movie to find that out. The movie was 2 and a half hours long, but it actually doesn't feel that long. But I was getting a bit anxious at times. Nonetheless, Johnson did well to give us a second act that delivered the goods. Action, adventure, peril, Jedi lore and yes, LOVE.
Okay, I'm assuming that you all will have one big question....Was it good? Yes, it was. Okay, maybe two big questions...Was it better than Force Awakens? Yes, very much so. I ask one more question...Was it the best ever, better than TESB. No, The Empire Strikes Back is still number one, at least for me. But this certainly tried hard to top that film.
I give it 3.5 to 4 Stars out of 5 (mainly due to some poor edits, and some over the top acting...I will leave that up to you to determine once you go see The Last Jedi.
SGG
A bit more enthusiasm than reality called for.
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Quote:And this walked back as well.
Originally posted by SHINYGOODGUY:
I would say, having seen TLJ once, that it's on an even keel with Rogue One.
I need to see it again because there was quite a bit going on in the story. Lots to see and experience.
I really like ANH because of it's historical significance in filmdom, and I once thought that ROTJ was best, but over the years TESB has grown on me in it's storytelling and overall scope. TLJ tries to match the wonderment and overall pace, but TESB has so much going for it. The scene where Luke meets Vader on Bespin as he tries to lure him into the carbonite machine. That's worth the price of admission alone.
Alas there are no catch phrases, other than "May the Force Be with you" but there are some special moments. It was funny in spots and it was involved emotionally, but it doesn't quite have the charm of the original second act in TESB. There were some similarities, but it fell short of that specialness we have come to know in Star Wars movies.
SGG
Although I didn't want to be so blunt as to spoil the fun for others who might actually enjoy it, I also don't feel that I posted anything in this thread which I should walk back.
Sometimes I feel a little heartbroken regarding the fate of Firefly, with a wondrous storyline, backstory, cast, writing, yet the backstabbing support and ultimate cancellation. Fans here who respect such things are those who might see the lapses of TLJ more clearly. This is not a Star Wars fansite. This is the site for fans of a work more worthy than TLJ, and perhaps TFA.
Only because of Rogue One do I hold out hope for the upcoming Han Solo prequel.
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Sorry, didn't like rogue one and heard this one sucks.
T 
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Yes, you are correct. I did walk back a lot of my initial review, as you point out.
Many amateur reviewers and Vlog fans did as well. There were those, as I stated above, that were extremely critical, some from the outset and their very first reviews, and yet others that were, like me, wanting to give it a chance to be good.
I must say that I'm not alone in that way of thinking and in how the movie was reviewed overall. Like I always say, I do not look at any reviews or comments beforehand so that I will not be influenced. I do feel a bit sheepish about my back track, but I gave my initial response.....
(and I usually respond on the fly. In other words, I write and submit my first draft with few exceptions. Sometimes I wait a few days to submit my thoughts, but this was one time that I wrote down my thoughts fresh from seeing The Last Jedi).
Still though, I did take a different tack. As I read back my review, I must say I was a bit off in my comments. There's so much I have to learn about being objective
in my comments and dissecting the true nature of a movie. I fucked up. Happens to the best of us. Since watching the movie and submitting my review, I was curious to see what others thought and I came across some truly savage/brutal reviews and some really insightful and thoughtful ones. So, there you have it.
One of the most anticipated movies of our generation, one that has set and reset box office records, was placed into the hands of a director who may have been overwhelmed by the enormity of the task at hand. Namely to deliver a blockbuster in the pantheon of blockbusters, and one of the most beloved franchises in filmdom history. Perhaps I too was overwhelmed.
SGG
Quote:
Originally posted by JEWELSTAITEFAN:Quote:
Originally posted by SHINYGOODGUY:
NO SPOILERS.....NO SPOILERS.....NO SPOILERS.....NO SPOILERS.....NO SPOILERS
I purposely did not read any reviews or watch all the trailers, just so that I could go in and totally immerse myself in the fantasy. There are parts that I really loved and some that I didn't, but overall I liked it.
First, a movie that had humor and some continuity. Although I wasn't too thrilled with some of the edits and jump cuts, but it did have pacing and overall movement much like the early trilogy. I felt that Director Johnson got a little too enamored of the melodrama, but he would intersperse humor, and so that would bring the pace back into play. Somehow I felt that Johnson overused the intercut between scenes which threatened to rob the movie of it's established pace (some establishment is a good thing).
The story, although somewhat involved, followed a logical pattern and accounted for itself well. Second, a movie that spoke of the past but only as a way to honor it. But this movie was about transition, both about the characters within the movie, as well as, the franchise itself. I got the feeling that Disney is looking for a way to transform the franchise and develop a new Jedi order. Perhaps even to recruit new members with Finn and Rey leading the way. And even perhaps the newest character Rose.
But I did like it. I liked the treatment of the overall story, funny, drama-filled when needed but always adventurous. The Last Jedi came the closest to the feeling I had to the original 3 episodes. I got the feeling that I had in TESB, the second and, to everyone's mind, the best of the whole lot. The one where we find out about Luke's father. We all waited patiently for that moment, that game-changer moment when we would find out about Rey's parents. NO SPOILERS HERE.....SORRY! You'll have to see the movie to find that out. The movie was 2 and a half hours long, but it actually doesn't feel that long. But I was getting a bit anxious at times. Nonetheless, Johnson did well to give us a second act that delivered the goods. Action, adventure, peril, Jedi lore and yes, LOVE.
Okay, I'm assuming that you all will have one big question....Was it good? Yes, it was. Okay, maybe two big questions...WNOTIFY: Y | REPLY | REPLY WITH QUOTE | PERMALINK | TOP | HOME
Not trying to be hypercritical, but I'll share a perspective on reviews. Pauline Kael never, ever gave a positive review of a film I liked.
Leonard Maltin often mailed in his reviews, and one I recall very well. He reviewed that a film was lousy, no reason to go see it, etc. It was the most adorable film, I was captivated and mesmerized by the performances of child actors like never before - when others like Elizabeth Taylor and Natalie Wood did so, they were sole kids among adults - and this was a majority kid cast. My suspension of disbelief was complete until I left the theater. One of my most cherished viewing experiences of my life.
Others who actually saw the film agreed, they loved it. It gained more Box Office than a shlock film should.
At one point Maltin was on his movie critic TV show, like a Siskel/Ebert copy. He "re-reviewed" this particular film, and changed his critique to a glowing endorsement. He was effectively admitting that he never even bothered to watch what may have been the best film of the year, before issuing his official review. It certainly damaged the Box Office haul. His original review is no longer available to read, only his walked back version after the film's run had ended, I think when it came out on VHS. It includes no mention of his dishonesty, only the resultant retroactive reversal.
I never again read or listened to his reviews. Why should I? What was his purpose in submitting a fake review of a film he never bothered to watch? What goal? Not that I had held him in any regard before - at that point I had read only one reviewer/critic who had a mostly accurate record (she may have been at 100%, hard to recall now).
For me, the purpose of a review is forewarning for others who follow (the masses), or a siren call and spotlight to identify what shouldn't be missed, what is worthy of your hard-earned coin. How did Maltin fit into this perspective? He didn't, he rendered himself obsolete and unfit. And this was not his only time, merely what I felt was the most blatent.
So when I post a review, I want to be helpful. Not Spoiler ala Ebert & Kick-Ass. Not false enthusiasm or hype. I'm not providing evidence of my wonderful writing and composition (albeit stilted online) for others to bask in. I fully expect that not a single film will ever be universally enjoyed by all. I knew a girl who did not like Sci-Fi films, not any, not one. Star Wars was the universally acknowledged blockbuster of all time, at the time - yet she could not see past the Sci-Fi label to enjoy any part of the film at all. Will Merchant Ivory fans revel in the latest Dirty Harry blockbuster? No. Will those with CGI addiction feast upon Wind River? I expect not. Will those in search of boobs and blondes revel in Saving Private Ryan? Likely not. Will those who avoid thinking enjoy Inception? No, it gave them headaches. How would I express for those who seek the enjoyment of Bridges of Madison County that this film really is what they are looking for? Did I really want to enjoy Valerian, TLJ, TFA? You bet, but my bias wouldn't help those who had not yet seen them. Was I surprised at how much I enjoyed Rogue One, Wind River, Arrival? Yep, and I wanted to let others know what they might be missing.
So I seek to provide direction, compass, windsock, enough information for the potential viewer to make an informed decision. Without giving away the whole story, or the key shocking turns, or spoilers.
The film that I used as example of Maltin's deceit was A Little Princess, starring Liesel Mathews, and with Camilla Belle, Lauren Blumenfeld, Rachael Bella, Die Hard veteran Taylor Fry, Vanessa Chester, Kaitlin Cullum, Vincent Schiavelli, Eleanor Bron, Rusty Shwimmer. A veritable showcase of young girl talent.
I try to keep this example in mind whenever reviewing a film, trying to ensure I don't do the same, and sort of my personal tribute to A Little Princess.
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