Is the Russia thing even real?
POSTED BY: BYTEMITE
UPDATED: Wednesday, April 9, 2025 19:29
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with Russia and Putin it's always good. He says they are the moral equivalent to the United States. When he was confronted with Putin being a murderer, he said we murder to. He pointed to Iraq. I recognize the tone of speak he displays for Russia.
That's actually one of the few times I've heard Trump speak where I didn't roll my eyes out of my head.
I think Russia is awful, but when Trump says "we have blood on our hands too," I have to sit back and think "well, for once he's not exactly wrong there."
But I will agree that it is super weird and does potentially seem out of character for Trump. He doesn't strike me as someone who puts anyone on an equal level to him, or ever admits to faults. Doing so, to him, I think makes him feel like he's given up ground, or given someone leverage over him.
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I don't think it's useful to imagine the "intelligence community" as an undifferentiated mass. I think the CIA-NSA-StateDepartment form their own nexus, as a group of rogue lawbreakers who do whatever they want, If the CIA doesn't get the money it wants, they fund themselves through illegal activities, and the State Department just goes sucking up to those quasi-government NGOs to do their dirty work for them.
and the DIA and FBI form another. I have no idea where the remaining 13 intelligence groups stand.
That's potentially fair. I've been a conspiracy theorist so long that it's pretty easy to just see them all as some amalgamated flesh monster from some horror film since they seem to use a lot of similar tactics and reasoning. But yeah, I do realize on some level that there are different factions and politics within that mass, and they're sometimes working at odds against each other.
Though I also think that no matter what faction we're looking at, I will probably feel like I don't like whatever they're doing or what their end goal is. I think that these groups operating in such secrecy are at odds with the concept of democracy/decision making by the public in a fundamental way.
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Quote:
Originally posted by BYTEMITE:
I respect that Jack. You and I have had a hard time seeing eye to eye lately, but perhaps some of that has been that you've felt like you had to keep defending yourself from other people.
That response indicates to me that you're listening to both sides and you're weighing them carefully.
I respect where you're coming from too. At this point, we don't have enough information. Anybody celebrating Trump's impending impeachment or anybody blindly defending Trump here is just showing their extreme prejudice from either side of the aisle (although everyone here in the RWED these days claims they are an independent and hold no party loyalty at the same time).
Chances are we won't ever really know what is happening. The CIA and other organizations like it are not middle school playgrounds. The only reason we know anything we hear on the news is because somebody wants us to know what we're hearing.
All I can say for sure is that SOMETHING is going on, and I don't like any of it.
Do Right, Be Right. :)
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Just to weigh in
There are many people claiming many different things Russia supposedly did.
Here's what I've gathered from the fractured and contradictory narrative to date about the DNC -
To go back to the DNC beginnings - way back when it first came out, Clapper made an interesting comment "(I'm) taken aback by the hyperventilation over this. ... I’m shocked someone did some hacking. That’s never happened before. (said dryly)” Also, at the time he refused to speculate on attribution. I believe that he was trying to keep it low key because in the world of cyber-spying, to enter into a spyagency-v-spyagency cyber-showdown would expose and disable too many lines of information. Anyway, that was the response before it got inflated for political purposes.
The story is murky on this point, but somehow the FBI believed that Russia had hacked the DNC. (Perhaps they were monitoring i-net communications.)
In any case the FBI went to the DNC with the warning, but the DNC was both slow to and inept at addressing the FBI's concerns, and separately, the DNC responded to a phishing attack that separately revealed years worth of Podesta emails.
But once the DNC did respond it hired CrowdStrike, and simultaneously locked the FBI out of looking at its servers directly.
SO ALL PUBLIC STATEMENTS MADE BY THE FBI AND OTHER INTELLIGENCE AGENCIES ARE PUBLICLY BASED ON THE LIMITED INFORMATION GIVEN TO THE FBI BY CROWDSTRIKE. And that information includes that the DNC server been breached by four or five SEPARATE intrusions.
IN THE MEANTIME, and ever since, wikileaks has insisted that the original DNC emails were handed off to them, person to person, by someone with legitimate access - a leaker, not a hacker.
Also, if you look at the dates, the latest dates of the released files are too old to have real relevance to the DNC. And the dates start and stop on specific dates, as if they were batch-loaded rather than gathered real-time.
There were a lot of statements made by select agencies and politicians - all without evidence - that have convinced idiots 'Russia hacked the election'. But I believe there are separate stories that were conflated for political gain. And these are the stories:
Russia - AND OTHER UNKNOWN ACTORS - were passively listening in on the DNC.
The US has also done similar eavesdropping on other nations.
This is SOP, and while despicable, it is in no way unusual or unexpected.
SEPARATELY, a DNC person, disgruntled by the corruption, leaked files to wikileaks.
The facts, however, didn't stop the Obama administration, the Clinton campaign, or the CIA from PLAYING GAMES AND THREATENING NATIONAL SECURITY RESOURCES, and lying about these events to mislead the public, and attempt to swing the election to Hillary.
But as a conclusion to all this, if you believe the media, and the agencies that make public statements to be carried by the media to a willing audience, the investigations concur.
http://www.reuters.com/article/us-usa-trump-intelligence-idUSKBN14204E
Tue Dec 13, 2016 | 9:36pm EST
Exclusive: Top U.S. spy agency has not embraced CIA assessment on Russia hacking - sources
The overseers of the U.S. intelligence community have not embraced a CIA assessment that Russian cyber attacks were aimed at helping Republican President-elect Donald Trump win the 2016 election, three American officials said on Monday.
http://theduran.com/james-clappers-office-cia-wrong-russia-clinton-lea
ks/
CIA wrong on Russia and Clinton leaks, says James Clapper’s office
December 13, 2016, 7:15 pm 14 3,545
James Clapper's Office says CIA claim Russia behind DNC and Podesta leaks to swing election to Donald Trump unproven. FBI concurs.
Also, there are many news stories that indicate Russia had no effect on the outcome of the election. But that's for another day.
How did your beloved 'democratic' party fuck up so badly?
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Originally posted by 1kiki:
Russia - AND OTHER UNKNOWN ACTORS - were passively listening in on the DNC.
The US has also done similar eavesdropping on other nations.
This is SOP, and while despicable, it is in no way unusual or unexpected.
I don't know about despicable. Whatever nations aren't actively and successfully doing this on a regular basis are going to fall behind. It has become one of those necessary evils with technology today.
Cyberwarfare is a thing, and it happens every minute of every day. Most folk don't think of it as war because they don't know a thing about computers or how they work.
I laugh today when I think about my mom and my grandma carrying around computers they call phones that are over 100 times more powerful than the desktop I learned on back in HS. Almost everybody in civilized countries use computers everyday now and don't know a damn thing about what goes on under the hood.
Do Right, Be Right. :)
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FWIW I find the whole 'we might as well do it to them since they're doing it to us' rather self-serving on the part of the spooks. If the US had a hardened system - and that includes personal computers WITHOUT BACK DOORS - hardened computers and servers - and encrypted communication - 'them others' couldn't spy on us. We'd be safe from the Rooskies and Chinee and identity thieves and everyone.
But then, 'our' spooks couldn't spy on us, either.
God forbid!
How did your beloved 'democratic' party fuck up so badly?
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You do have a point there. And if we are to believe Gene Hackman's character from Enemy of the State any tech we have in our possession the Government had 20 years ago.
The problem is that nothing is really impervious to hacking. For years my "Mac guy" brother told me that Apple products were un-hackable. That obviously wasn't the case... there just weren't many businesses or people using them to make it worth while trying to hack them when PCs were so much easier to hack and had a much bigger potential payoff.
It's not all 1's and 0's either. The biggest threat to cyber security is social engineering. The only meaningful step toward having a completely un-hackable system is SkyNET, and I don't think that's a road any of us are really looking forward to going down...... even though it is just a matter of time.
Do Right, Be Right. :)
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Byte,
A few thoughts here.
1) The NWO has hated Russia so long that it no longer remembers why.
2) We hates it, my precious, so much, that yes, just tagging someone with a Russian flag is enough.
3) Everyone has business dealings with Russia. Even I have business dealing with Russia. But Ivanka is married to an ethnic Russian, half his family speaks it, it's no secret that Putin wanted Trump because Hillary was threatening to nuke Russia. The HRC herself actually did make 3 million off arranging the Uranium deal he mentioned.
Talk, all talk? Probably. HRC wouldn't have nuked Russia, but she would have gone to war over Ukraine. And Syria. And now Trump is talking sending troops to Syria on the Assad side. So, sure, there's been a bit of a switch.
Blowing the ship out of the water, definitely all talk. That would not start a war, it happens every few years, but random morons do it, not heads of state.
Putin, mind you, is doing the exact some thing to the Russian press, trying to verbally distance himself from Trump. I'm sure the two of them can't wait to meet and get this nonsense behind them. The holdover of half a century of cold war is hard for either establishment to get over.
Another flipped variable: Obama admin was so cold shoulder to Israel that Netanyahu turned to Putin for assistance like 6 times last year. Ivanka, who might be de facto president, is an orthodox jew, so all that matters now.
Hacked emails turned out to be leaked by someone at the State Dept offic. HRC fired. He got them off of the server, because Podesta's password was "password"
It's like the story of HRC getting the debate questions came out because she went backstage and ranted at her staff about having a question asked that wasn't pre-approved.
All you have to do in cases like this is show Julian Assange where the gold is, and he'll dig. If Russia *DID* have the power to rig a US election, we'd already be done for.
Muslim ban. This sort of thing is the sad truth about Trump: He's not different enough. The ban is the same one Obama passed a year ago, the wall is the same old wall plan Hillary supported in '06, which is already partially built. A whole lot of this is same old same old. The Clintons were at the Trumps wedding, they vacation together, Ivanka and Chelsea are BFFs.
So, we never really get free of it, but the press et al are certainly hopping mad that sudden for the first time since the 80s, we're not at war.
So there's a lot of empty rhetoric, and meaningless gestures which are done to please one oligarch or another, and some people die because of it.
But when we leave our pro-German stance for a pro-Russian one, what will be the fallout, and who will really be driving it?
Trump is like a Fezzik with an ewok on his head playing monkey in the middle while various nefarious NWO types pull him in their directions. So, while he's playing the part, brinksman ship with china, occasionally slipping up and remembering that he speaks Spanish, we better hope someone, Ivanka or Pence, figures out what's going on, and knows how to play it intentionally.
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Originally posted by DREAMTROVE:
Hacked emails turned out to be leaked by someone at the State Dept offic. HRC fired. He got them off of the server, because Podesta's password was "password"
Social Engineering, and lol.... "Password"
Very interesting post there DT.
Do Right, Be Right. :)
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Thanks.
Yeah, and seems the media has yet to realize its irrelevance. Trump also. He's talking about CNN. Their evening news has like 1.4 million viewers. Trump's own twitter feed has 15 times that. If someone heard about what CNN said about Trump, they probably heard it from Trump. He should see to that.
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