Surreal World Event Discussion
POSTED BY: HKCavalier
UPDATED: Thursday, July 1, 2004 01:03
VIEWED: 6443
PAGE 3 of 3
Wow, nice post, HKC! We mostly agree on all that stuff (although I wonder how foreign workers are highly-trained in Rickker's post and exploited in yours).
Here's a statistic for the sake of optimism, and I do tend to be very optimistic about the American spirit and people: we've all heard the griping about American jobs outsourced, but there are more foreign jobs outsorced to U.S. workers than the other way around.
NOTIFY: N | REPLY | REPLY WITH QUOTE | PERMALINK | TOP | HOME
Niiice posts! 
It's really HIlarious how people in the USA seem to misclassify thier political parties. How can Americans not be assured about the positions of the Republicans or the Democrates?
Well, when Americans watch CNN or FOX or any "news" program it always seems to be from one point of view. The view that America can't do wrong and is completely justified in invading Iraq because of the criminal act of war we call 9/11.
But... we learned that Iraq has nothing to do with 9/11, or Osama, and to top it all off we learn that (despite screaming warnings of WMD destruction from the White House and 10 Downing St.) Iraq isn't even a mild threat.
And who has the honour of informing America of this? Some fat guy from Michigan.
Well, if it takes a film maker like Moore, who isn't exactly Noam Chomsky or anything, to tell America it's because ... as HKCavalier wrote: And to top it off did that "This is not a time for pessimism and rage, this is a time for optimism, steady leadership and progress" stuff sound even just a little like "War is Peace, Freedom is Slavery, Ignorance is Stregth?" Just a little?
When I turn on the TV and watch CNN... it's an Orwellian dog wag unheard of in the West. The news media language is very precise and evasive. CNN reporters simply don't ask hard questions. I noticed that last week when an Irish reporter asked G.W. Bush the real questions, the White House pressured the Irish to suppress the interview and fire the reporter.
The President of the USA wants to crush free speach when it comes to his governement. Truly un-American!
It all changed in the Media when "convergance" was instituted with the latest wave of "deregulation" (often mistaken by Americans as a reduction of Government... suckers!). This deregulation allowed giant mega-media corporations to push thier political views through all thier holdings. The result is the very same stories, word for word, comeing from your newspaper, TV, and whtever else they cram the "news" into. Naturally, since a mega-media corp. contributed to the Bush Junte than they will promote Bush and the War in Iraq. So much so that they have failed in thier Constitutional Duty as Americans to inform the people. The Fifth Estate.
America has been led down the "Vietnam II" path, as it were, and Americans will still be sent by thier incredibly rich elite (that's Bush, Cheney, and the 1% who have all the money and power... and now, all the news media) to die in Iraq for the next 10 years. Trust me.
And every crazy head-chopping nut looking to hate the West will still be the star of your CNN special report... it's evey terrorists dream come true! And you can thank the American press for that. You can thank the White House for the rest.
btw, as much as I find the Bush ads to be horrific, and I don't mind a comparison to Nazi propoganda as I think the parallels are just too close, I did go over to Moveon.org and... *chuckle*, the Democrate stuff isn't much better! lol!
NOTIFY: Y | REPLY | REPLY WITH QUOTE | PERMALINK | TOP | HOME
Quote:
Originally posted by Ghoulman:
Well, when Americans watch CNN or FOX or any "news" program it always seems to be from one point of view. The view that America can't do wrong and is completely justified in invading Iraq because of the criminal act of war we call 9/11.
Baloney. http://michnews.com/artman/publish/article_4063.shtml
Quote:
Originally posted by Ghoulman:
But... we learned that Iraq has nothing to do with 9/11, or Osama, and to top it all off we learn that (despite screaming warnings of WMD destruction from the White House and 10 Downing St.) Iraq isn't even a mild threat.
Double Baloney!
http://www.newsmax.com/archives/ic/2004/6/25/114037.shtml
http://www.lenconnect.com/articles/2004/06/28/news/news05.txt
http://worldnetdaily.com/news/article.asp?ARTICLE_ID=39151
Quote:
Originally posted by Ghoulman:
And who has the honour of informing America of this? Some fat guy from Michigan.
I think you mean MIS-informing.
http://www.newsmax.com/archives/ic/2004/6/29/121539.shtml
"The Sept. 11 Commission has found that the Bush administration's war on terror has severely impaired al Qaida's ability to organize another spectacular attack against the U.S. homeland by capturing or killing the deadly terror group's key leaders, drying up their financial resources and severely limiting their ability to strategize, plan attacks, and dispatch operatives worldwide."
And, just for fun...
http://www.newsmax.com/archives/articles/2004/6/23/165945.shtml
NOTIFY: N | REPLY | REPLY WITH QUOTE | PERMALINK | TOP | HOME
War against a foreign country only happens when the moneyed classes think they are going to profit from it. Every war when it comes, or before it comes, is represented not as a war but as an act of self-defense against a homocidal maniac" - George Orwell
NOTIFY: Y | REPLY | REPLY WITH QUOTE | PERMALINK | TOP | HOME
Quote:
Originally posted by JCKnife:
Wow, nice post, HKC! We mostly agree on all that stuff
Thank you
Quote:
(although I wonder how foreign workers are highly-trained in Rickker's post and exploited in yours).
Not really. If you read his post, it's his friend that thinks work goes to the best trained workers. Riccker said that in practice the work goes to the cheepest workers.
Quote:
Here's a statistic for the sake of optimism, and I do tend to be very optimistic about the American spirit and people: we've all heard the griping about American jobs outsourced, but there are more foreign jobs outsorced to U.S. workers than the other way around.
My girlfriend is in the shipping industry, at the very heart of the capitalist system. She talks to business people from every corner of the world on a daily basis. I asked her about your statistic today and she just snorted. Neither of us have any idea what you're talking about, JC! What foreign industry would outsource to the U.S.? With all the regulations and minimum wages and unions stinking up the place, you'd think they could get a better deal in any number of less regulated, cheaper, less organized markets overseas. Please, enlighten us, would you?
EDIT: Hold the phone! You talking about weapons? 'Cause yeah, the majority of arms in the world have been made right here in the good ol' U.S. of A. (remember Iran/Contra?)! Sorry for the snarky tone, JC, but I really am not happy about my beloved country's militarism. And it tickles me to think of our exporting of arms as "outsourcing."
It's really my greatest beef with the current admin. HKCavalier
Hey, hey, hey, don't be mean. We don't have to be mean, because, remember, no matter where you go, there you are.
NOTIFY: Y | REPLY | REPLY WITH QUOTE | PERMALINK | TOP | HOME
Quote:
Originally posted by Ghoulman:
War against a foreign country only happens when the moneyed classes think they are going to profit from it. Every war when it comes, or before it comes, is represented not as a war but as an act of self-defense against a homocidal maniac" - George Orwell
That quote deserves a bump! Clever man, that Orwell. Welcome to my thread, Ghoulman.
HKCavalier
Hey, hey, hey, don't be mean. We don't have to be mean, because, remember, no matter where you go, there you are.
NOTIFY: Y | REPLY | REPLY WITH QUOTE | PERMALINK | TOP | HOME
Quote:
Originally posted by HKCavalier:
Neither of us have any idea what you're talking about, JC! What foreign industry would outsource to the U.S.?
Always happy to back up my comments with evidence:
http://www.philly.com/mld/dailynews/9017866.htm?1c
http://www.tennessean.com/business/archives/04/05/52058247.shtml?Eleme
nt_ID=52058247
NOTIFY: N | REPLY | REPLY WITH QUOTE | PERMALINK | TOP | HOME
Hey JC,
Didn't get into your first url, but I did the second. Thanks.
I gotta say: Japan coming over here to build cars and "get into the very lucrative U.S. markets" isn't exactly what I would call "outsourcing." I don't think that's what anyone who's unhappy with U.S. corporations outsourcing means when they say outsourcing. Strictly speaking sure, but you're really just taking advantage of the most literal meaning of the word. Usage and context account for a lot of what a given word means--ask anyone who's tried to learn english!
Microsoft isn't moving to India because the Indians buy so many computers, and nobody has their paperwork and accounting done in Singapore, to sell spreadsheets to South East Asia. We're talking about exploitation of cheap labor. It's an ethical issue. Should American corporations outsource jobs to cheap foreign workers, while the jobless rates in our industrial centers is so high? And notice: I'm not saying they shouldn't be allowed to, only questioning if it is really the right thing to do.
HKCavalier
Hey, hey, hey, don't be mean. We don't have to be mean, because, remember, no matter where you go, there you are.
NOTIFY: Y | REPLY | REPLY WITH QUOTE | PERMALINK | TOP | HOME