War in Afghanistan
POSTED BY: Niki2
UPDATED: Friday, November 28, 2025 16:36
VIEWED: 6755
PAGE 5 of 8
Quote:
Originally posted by out2theblack:
Start respecting others
I happen to believe everyone deserves respect until they lose it. This whole idea that people have to earn your respect is self-indulgent bullshit. Who the fuck are you to expect others to have to earn your respect?
A person deserves respect because, but they can work to lose it.
And you do work very hard O2B. Niki has been nothing but respectful to everyone, as far as I can see. You on the other hand, are a constant and unremitting cunt. You have no right to use the term respect, because you clearly have none for anyone.
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Nature is chaos. This forum has laws like nature has laws, not like a country. We already agreed that ettiquette in this case was to not obcure the meaning of the thread title. I missed the specific change. Personal attacks on any side are uncalled for. I think we all agreed on that. I see a lot of it here.
I personally changed the thread title as anyone can see, to what it is now, a long time ago, on my first post, because I thought this more clearly reflected the topic, and I wasn't feeling particularly clever or in appreciation of cleverness, I just wanted a differentiation between discussions about Afghanistan and those specifically about the war.
"It does not matter whether the war is actually happening, and, since no decisive victory is possible, it does not matter whether the war is going well or badly. All that is needed is that a state of war should exist.
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Quote:
Originally posted by dreamtrove:
Personal attacks on any side are uncalled for. I think we all agreed on that. I see a lot of it here.
I 100% agree. However: Niki IMHO is perhaps one of the most respectful posters about here. Hell more respectful than me. So when one of the least respectful starts shouting about respect at the most respectful, I can't help but say something.
Colour me imperfect
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Either your with the terrorists, or ... your with the terrorists 
Lets party like its 1939
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Yes; way back at the top, I had started the thread with a title which the thread on Afghan culture was changed to: "Af-gun-istan". DT was kind enough to change it to "Afghan War", which is more appropriate. Then I changed it this last time to "War in Afghanistan" because, as I said, it's not the AFGHAN war, they didn't start it, it's our war in Afghanistan.
And thank you for your kind words, Citizen. But to say I have been nothing but respectful is something I DEFINITELY don't deserve; you've experienced my lack of respect yourself, so you know that's not true. I fail at self-control far more than I succeed, I'm afraid; tho' I do TRY to be mindful and not let my feelings deprive the conversation of respect. Which is NOT meant to be any kind of "holier than thou" comment...I know myself, I know I screw up, I'm just saying I try.
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Quote:
Originally posted by Niki2:
And thank you for your kind words, Citizen. But to say I have been nothing but respectful is something I DEFINITELY don't deserve; you've experienced my lack of respect yourself, so you know that's not true. I fail at self-control far more than I succeed, I'm afraid; tho' I do TRY to be mindful and not let my feelings deprive the conversation of respect.
Aye, the watch word was as far as I can see. It's all relative, and the trying is the worthiest part.
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Quote:
Originally posted by Fremdfirma:
This is why no one listens to you even when you have a point, Out2B.
Being an ass because you can be an ass buys ya nothin, and earning the respect of others is key in getting them to listen to you - plus it's a two way street, you want some, you'd damn well better be giving some, and you ain't.
So where does that leave you ?
-F
Still at the top of the game , discussion-wise...
Now , you've devolved your input to the point of irrelevance...I had expected and hoped for better from you , because you're capable of it...
However , you have once again happened late-ly into the scene of the party , and apparently have no awareness of what has gone before...
Just a quick refresher , now that you've taken the mad-dog ears of someone else's argument :
Quote:
Originally posted by out2theblack:Quote:
Originally posted by dreamtrove:
Niki
Thanks, and good idea.
I'm going to change the title. I skipped this thread on the first pass because I assumed it was PN (sorry John, you post more than I have time to read.)
ETA: I also changed to "Afghan" assuming the greater meaning to include the Pashtun of Pakistan and any related populations which might get caught up in this conflict.
For Folk permaybehaps wondering about the motive for this present war in AFbamaScam , check out this google search result :
http://www.google.com/search?q=Cheney+pipeline+Afghanistan&sourceid=ie
7&rls=com.microsoft:en-US&ie=utf8&oe=utf8
Interesting reading , should hold Folk for a few ticks...Poly-ticks...Many bloodsuckers...
Quote:
Originally posted by out2theblack:Quote:
Originally posted by Niki2:
...Most of us don't wonder, we already know the answer to that, just as we do to the reasons for the war in Iraq. I believe DT enumerated it quite clearly in another post, and I agree with 3 out of his 4 conclusions.
I happen to agree with more than 75% of DT's conclusions in this matter...
Isn't the point of discussion to educate and inform ?
If you already *know* all the answers , why are you still raising the questions ? Just looking for another opportunity to beat your gums , so to speak ?
http://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/asia/can-the-americans-win-a-l
and-war-in-afghanistan-670448.html
Sunday, 23 September 2001
' "We do deserts, we don't do mountains," said Colin Powell when he was chairman of the Joint Chiefs of Staff as the Balkans' conflict erupted. '
http://www.ringnebula.com/Oil/Timeline.htm
Quote:
Originally posted by Niki2:Quote:
If you already *know* all the answers , why are you still raising the questions ? Just looking for another opportunity to beat your gums , so to speak ?
Gawd, OTB, you’re a real asshole, aren’t you?? I quite clearly said I don’t know all the answers, and I wasn’t asking any questions…answered Byte’s question to the best of my ability, and started this out by saying “Okay, here's a new thread where we can rant and rave and offer our opinions of the war itself. What does any of that have to do with your asinine statement? Nothing, obviously. What thread were YOU reading? You’re strange. And nasty.Quote:
Originally posted by citizen:Quote:
Originally posted by out2theblack:
Start respecting others
I happen to believe everyone deserves respect until they lose it. This whole idea that people have to earn your respect is self-indulgent bullshit. Who the fuck are you to expect others to have to earn your respect?
A person deserves respect because, but they can work to lose it.
And you do work very hard O2B. Niki has been nothing but respectful to everyone, as far as I can see. You on the other hand, are a constant and unremitting cunt. You have no right to use the term respect, because you clearly have none for anyone.
Once again , despite the Vile Comments from Niki and her top-of-the-Go*Se partner
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Okay, just bumping this to ask another question. I was looking up some information on the Afghanistan War today, and I read that Al Qaeda were trained/associated with the Russians, rather than having fought the Russians, while the CIA trained counterparts in the proxy war were the Mujahideen.
Wikipedia ref:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mujahideen
Is this right?
And that when the Mujahideen took Kabul and couldn't establish a stable government, the Taliban rose to challenge them?
But I'd heard Al Qaeda was established by the CIA.
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Byte
Not quite.
The Mujahideen is a militant organization, or rather, a group of them. Each country has its own, and the character of each can be radically different.
Al Qaeda would be best qualified as a charity. It's an international communication network for the distribution of goods and services by charitable donors to recipients. Like Hezbollah, upon which it was modeled, by Osama bin Laden, it supports military resistance fighters as well as hospitals, schools and other projects throughout the muslim world.
It's a popular misconception, popularized by the western media, that Al Qaeda is a terrorist organization, though, of course, it has ties to terrorism, it has ties to lots of things. One thing it isn't is a military force in its own right.
The Afghan Mujahideen has very close ties to Al Qaeda since Osama had joined the AM before creating Al Qaeda. AQ and HzB are actually based on the internet, in their structure, for true irony.
The "who supports whom" speculation always flies, but the general assumption is that the US supported the Mujahideen, and post-communist Russia supports the Taliban, which is majorly opposed by China. Both the US and Russia IIRC have supported the Northern Alliance, but given the changing membership I'm not sure that's proof of anything.
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And of course, with most of the militants/insurgents/whatever you wanna call em, there's a LOT of "So, who's side are we on THIS week ?" kind of philosophy about it, because they mostly wanna be left alone, and anyone agressing on them tends to get shot at.
People forget just how bloody territorial these folk are, most especially the Pashtun, who will absolutely go freakin berserk chasing you off their turf, but stop right at the line, laugh and go home once they have done so - it's a whole DIFFERENT mindset, and for the most part the reason that whole fight em over there bullshit doesn't fly with me cause most of em truly do not care one whit what happens outside their own turf.
Historically it's a bad idea to continue pursuit past that anyways because there's always some other tribe ready to roll in and take over while all your warriors are busy on a wild goose chase, so there's a certain amount of "intertia" - these guys do NOT like to give up home field advantage, which is why the more mobile forces like the northern alliance are usually outcasts or younger folk who ran off looking for adventure.
Most folk have barely even the lightest grasp of the mindset we're dealing with there, and for a fact our military command has not a damn clue, far less than even some of the brighter ground pounders we got on site - one of whom was relating to me how they deliberately provoked a "Red on Red" fire incident to sweep up a group who was planting IEDs by provoking another group to attack after his team moved one of the IEDs and that second group wandered into it, and knowing who to blame, unlike our troops, they went after em, and our guys followed them up, and made some new friends that way - not EVERY troop we got is a complete dumbass, but many of em are, yeah.
-F
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