Star point up. Triangle point down.

POSTED BY: yellowjacket
UPDATED: Thursday, July 14, 2011 02:45
VIEWED: 14077
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FILLYGIRL

Thursday, May 21, 2009 9:12 AM

Just thought I say something, the 76th Battalion changed what we could (star position and patch position) so we would NOT have any problems with copyright infringement. The way is was suppose to be did come up, but we wanted to be safe and not completely copy it. If anybody else from the 76th has more info, post it.

Chaplain of the 76th Independant Battalion

Do not bother dragons, for you are crunchy and taste good with ketchup!

...it's worse than you know...Operative
...it usually is.....Mal

SIMONWHO

Thursday, May 21, 2009 10:32 AM

I say we put these wretched big-endians to death - it's the only language they understand.

KWICKO

Thursday, May 21, 2009 11:32 AM

Okay, just tossing this out there in an effort to help those who want to find an in-series explanation that might help ease their souls...

It's been posted that the upside-down patch is a sign of disrespect, and something Mal would absolutely NOT do. But what hasn't been pointed out is that, with the American flag at least, hanging the flag upside down isn't a sign of disrespect, but rather a sign of desperation: it means your position is in imminent danger of being overrun and you are in need of immediate assistance. As an Independent, that's a feeling Mal probably knows only too well. Perhaps he sewed his patch on upside-down in a sardonic (Mal, sardonic? Naaaaaahhhh...) nod to the dire straits the Browncoats ALWAYS found themselves in.

Hey, if it works for the story, feel free to spread it around; if it doesn't, then please disregard.

Mike

Build a man a fire and he'll be warm for a day...
Set a man on fire and he'll be warm for the rest of his life.

BYTEMITE

Thursday, May 21, 2009 1:57 PM

PhoenixRose: I think I also brought up the implications of the inverted star in a similar conversation to this one.

Looking past the "horns, ears, and chin" description that Christians assigned to it, villifying pagan satyr/goat nature gods as Satans, or "enemy" to the church... Originally it was a symbol of the four classical elements and spirit, all combined into a stylized human form (head, two arms, two legs). It's not truly an evil symbol. Just subverted.

But you're right in that in modern times, an inverted five pointed star carries symbolism that Joss would not have intended.

Unfortunately, it is how it is.

BYTEMITE

Thursday, May 21, 2009 2:00 PM

KWICKO: Oooh, I LIKE that! Nicely done!

ROCKETJOCK

Thursday, May 21, 2009 3:16 PM

How's about this: The insignia was intended to be worn star-point-up, but Mal (and presumably other survivors of the Shadow Massacre) wear theirs reversed as a sign of mourning for their lost homeworld.

"She's tore up plenty. But she'll fly true." -- Zoë Washburn

BYTEMITE

Thursday, May 21, 2009 3:42 PM

Another good one.

I've always liked to think that Shadow's ruin happened about at the end of the war, because I couldn't imagine how Mal could be so upbeat while fighting if he was still mourning the loss of his world. I even imagined that the surrender of the Independents might have been a response to the way Shadow was destroyed, and that Mal could be reacting to the dual loss of the war and loss of his world while watching the firebombing come his way.

But supposedly in the Visual Companion, Joss explains that Shadow happened early on. Don't know. All I do know is that from sources I've read, the destruction was absolute and the world is completely unlivable now. The RPG manual says in the entry under Shadow that "No one lives there. No one can." Some may not consider the RPG manual canon, but I've seen enough "facts" it puts forward later confirmed that I use it as a valid reference. "Burn the land and boil the seas" in the Firefly theme song has been proposed to be a reference to Shadow's destruction.

What I'm getting at here is that Shadow also had to be after the war started and Independents began recruiting, because otherwise Mal would've died on Shadow with everyone else. It's destruction could not have started the war.

YELLOWJACKET

Thursday, May 21, 2009 3:48 PM

Phoenix Rose - Just clarifying that a star is just a star unless we attach symbolism to it. Thanks for your input.

Filly Girl - As I mentioned, the 76th patch is fine for multiple reasons.

Kwicko - Yes. This is one of many popular fan mythologies tied to the error.

Rocket Jock - Also another popular fan-based mythology tied to the error.

Your answers can be as simple as 'Star point up' or 'Star point down'.

CANON (star point up): 2
FAN INTERPRETED (star point down): 3
UNDECIDED: 2

PENNAUSAMIKE

Friday, May 22, 2009 5:43 AM

The patches were originally intended to denote rank and have the triangle point down and the star upright.
But in the rush of television production work,
a seamstress sewed the patch on "upside-down".

Notice Geoffrey Mandel continued the star point up, triangle point down and also, that the Alliance emblems are opposite from the Independents.
So, I prefer Alliance triangles point-up, Independent triangles point-down.

Mike

YELLOWJACKET

Friday, May 22, 2009 4:02 PM

CANON (star point up): 3
FAN INTERPRETED (star point down): 3
UNDECIDED: 2

When Mike dies I'm stealing his stuff.

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