Dollhouse: Haunted - Echo is a dead person. Post comments here.

POSTED BY: Haken
UPDATED: Tuesday, May 5, 2009 22:42
VIEWED: 130445
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YINYANG

Saturday, April 25, 2009 5:48 PM

I felt like the previews for the next episode were more interesting than this one. I did like the Ballard subplot; I think it was well-done, and did what I wanted it to do - admit Ballard's complicity in the affairs of the Dollhouse. I do wish he'd found out more, but the fingerprint scan erasing was alright, I guess, and the next episode looks to be great. Topher with geek Sierra was really awesome, and he is definitely a big twelve year old - unlike pretty much every other Dollhouse client, there was no indication (at least that I saw) that he got sexual (AKA rape-y) with her. Although Topher is still pretty damned by his actions, I'm more okay with liking him.

Everything else - Echo's assignment - was blah.

GILLIANROSE

Saturday, April 25, 2009 5:52 PM

I liked Topher and Sierra's story. It struck me that both he and Adele had "dates" that knew all about the Dollhouse. So they have to program a Doll in order to have someone in their lives they can talk to about their work. It made me think how isolated they must be. And if it is Topher's birthday, as the Twinkie would suggest, that makes me infer he has no family or he has no contact with them. And, does he live at the Dollhouse? I wonder if his "friendship" with Sierra will ever be a factor in the future, will ever influence what he'll be willing to send her to do, especially with that creepy man who claims to have made her a Doll in the first place.

VELROOM

Saturday, April 25, 2009 7:36 PM

Please don't put spoilers about an episode in a subject heading cause those of us with RSS feeds from this site get the subjects, and it spoilerizes us if we haven't seen the ep. :) No biggie, but just a reminder that one can get spoiled without coming directly to a thread, just by headings. Thanks.

HAKEN

Saturday, April 25, 2009 7:50 PM

Quote:
Originally posted by velroom:
Please don't put spoilers about an episode in a subject heading cause those of us with RSS feeds from this site get the subjects, and it spoilerizes us if we haven't seen the ep. :) No biggie, but just a reminder that one can get spoiled without coming directly to a thread, just by headings. Thanks.

Sorry about that. I thought it was fairly common knowledge since it was in all the promos.

ASARIAN

Sunday, April 26, 2009 6:43 AM

Quote:
Originally posted by FlatTop:
Topher: Loved it. Yeah, it's covering territory we've already been over, but now it's Topher's turn to have a dream date. We get to learn a bit more about him as a person.

Loved that as well. And I'm beginning to like Sierra more and more, too.

Problem just is, the timing of this episode was a bit off. And I'm not referring to its time-slot or whatever, but to having three virtually identical themes aired twice in a row: Echo as spy-investigator + a Dollhouse staff member indulging in a private indiscretion + a doll wanting to have a doll (Sierra wanting to play with the 'sleepies'). That could have been handled better.

The 'Life ever-lasting' skipped on the more interesting aspects of 'resurrecting' a dead person, but was fun nonetheless.

And Echo looked more beautiful in this ep than ever before.

--
"Mei-mei, everything I have is right here." -- Simon Tam

BIGRICHARD

Sunday, April 26, 2009 1:36 PM

I actually really liked this episode and wasn't that put off by the lack of story arc. But I do agree that it's odd they had this so close to Needs.

Echo: Eliza was brilliant at playing the posh, rich woman who was finding out about herself through her loved ones eyes, although, as previously said, it could have explored the everlasting life option a bit more, although I think they did well, basically saying that you had to take over someone else's life and that Adele wasn't willing to exploit her business like that, and her friend realised that, and had accepted a peaceful death, rather than an inevitable more horrific one.

Ballard: I agree that he did what he felt he had to do with Millie, that only when she was beginning to distance herself did he 'bite the bullet' and sleep with her. I think the way it happened seemed right, as he was angry with himself and with the dollhouse for making him do this, and it shows that he doesn't really consider Millie a person anymore, just another assignment. His shower seemed to symbolise his attempt to cleanse himself.

Topher: I really liked the Topher storyline, even though it was similar to DeWitt's in 'Needs'. Mainly because you always see Topher talking and joking with other people who treat him fairly poorly. They ignore his jokes and seem to almost 'use' him for his mind, rather than care for him as a person, and it was heartbreaking to see that the only way he can have a 'friend' is by creating it. Almost like a small child who has to invent a friend at kindergarten because all the children there tease him/her.

I look forward to next weeks episode (even though I switched off before the preview) just to get back to the story arc, but this episode was fantastic, if only for the ideas it presented and the additional pieces we got to some of the character puzzles.

BYTEMITE

Sunday, April 26, 2009 6:47 PM

The Topher thing was my favourite part of the episode! I especially liked when they were throwing the ball around and Sierra was sounding off on common problem tropes in the sci-fi genre. It's kind of a look see into Joss' mind about what he thinks is overdone.

I stopped disliking Topher probably somewhere between the third and fifth episode, it's hard to hate someone when they are just incapable of realizing that what they're doing is wrong. I mean, look at Firefly, does anyone hate Kaylee because she helps out on crimes? Granted, her personality is more endearing than Topher, and maybe her engineering has less direct criminal implication than Topher's technology. But like Topher, she doesn't seem to acknowledge the morally questionable nature of her job.

And hey, at least he discouraged the idea about making the "sleepies" engage in gladiatoral combat. Although that was probably more because DeWitt would kill him than concern for their well being, but who knows?

Ballard? Bad deal. It's hard exactly for me to tell just how much of what he did was Mellie seducing him and him giving in even though he knew it was only what she was programmed to do, and how much of it was trying to protect both their covers. Heroes aren't so heroic, you know, and not everyone can be perfect and unaffected all the time. I do feel bad for him and November.

BIGRICHARD

Monday, April 27, 2009 12:47 AM

Quote:
Bytemite originally said:
I stopped disliking Topher probably somewhere between the third and fifth episode, it's hard to hate someone when they are just incapable of realizing that what they're doing is wrong. I mean, look at Firefly, does anyone hate Kaylee because she helps out on crimes? Granted, her personality is more endearing than Topher, and maybe her engineering has less direct criminal implication than Topher's technology. But like Topher, she doesn't seem to acknowledge the morally questionable nature of her job.

Ahh, but see now we're getting into two things:
- Is what Topher is doing 'wrong'?
and
- Just how bad were the crew of Serenity?

In the first instance, you feel bad blaming anyone in the Dollhouse, I particularly like Topher, Boyd and DeWitt, as I have from the start, mainly because, most of the time, I don't have a problem with them. The Dollhouse, most of the time it seems, isn't anything wrong. It's all about filling needs, and most of the time, it's keeping people happy, not to mention helping situations (at the school when the virus got loose) and saving kidnapped children, among other things. The only real trouble I've had with the Dollhouse is since finding out that Sierra wasn't there of her own free will, which makes it possible that others aren't either, which is worrying, hopefully a rational explanation for why DeWitt would do something like that will come about in the future, it's possible she struck a deal with Sierra as well, just like Echo.
Regardless, Topher is still young, and sometimes acts younger, but that could be due to his lack of socialising with people his age. Currently he hangs around with very few people, and those that are around, are much older and very serious most of the time. Topher, being the genius he is, probably had a very lonely childhood, especially since he reached however old he is now, and has already developed this technology. He possibly realises what he's doing is wrong, but doesn't know anything other than science, and that he is (fairly) greatly appreciated in the Dollhouse, which might keep him happy enough.

Wow have I crapped on long enough. I'll leave the other question open for now.

BYTEMITE

Monday, April 27, 2009 1:08 AM

Well, yes, what he's doing is wrong. I hate to resort to trite arguments, but the ends don't justify the means. Dollhouse may be helpful, but what they do to actives is abuse, regardless of happy non-stressful, peaceful, yoga enriched environments.

And erasing people is a lot like murder, whether or not the Dollhouse has their consent.

I suspect none of the actives were willing; November's story about wanting to forget the death of a daughter seems slightly contrived. Would Victor and Echo found simiarly shallow backstories if they had looked? Was what Sierra found out what she was supposed to find out?

My opinion of the crew of Serenity is that they have the capacity to do harm. They don't mean to and most likely have good intentions, but in their line of work, they don't always find out just what it is they're stealing, and they don't always return the medicine when they do.

BIGRICHARD

Monday, April 27, 2009 1:40 AM

I don't really disagree with any of your post, as I see exactly what you mean, but that doesn't mean I agree with it exactly. Really I need to know more about the Dollhouse before I decide if it's right or wrong, or if it really is one or the other.

On the crew of Serenity, you've hit the nail on the head, they don't mean to do harm, but I guess, for instance, it's better Jayne is helping them than the thugs he was helping before, and they do help some people in their line of business, so I'd say they hop between being 'good' and 'bad'.

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