Gun Control Spin
POSTED BY: AnthonyT
UPDATED: Sunday, November 25, 2007 19:08
VIEWED: 6740
PAGE 2 of 8
Quote:How many nuclear bombs do you have geezer? (I mean while we're using the slippery slope fallacy).
Originally posted by Geezer:
http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/health/4581871.stmQuote:
Doctors' kitchen knives ban call
A&E doctors are calling for a ban on long pointed kitchen knives to reduce deaths from stabbing.
A team from West Middlesex University Hospital said violent crime is on the increase - and kitchen knives are used in as many as half of all stabbings.
They argued many assaults are committed impulsively, prompted by alcohol and drugs, and a kitchen knife often makes an all too available weapon.
The research is published in the British Medical Journal.
The researchers said there was no reason for long pointed knives to be publicly available at all.
After they get all the "assualt" rifles, guess they'll be coming after the "arsenal" in my kitchen. I've also got some rather pointy screwdrivers in the shop, along with hammers and handsaws. And the splitting maul I use to chop firewood...oh, dear.
"Keep the Shiny side up"
More insane ramblings by the people who brought you beeeer milkshakes!
No one can see their reflection in running water. It is only in still water that we can see.
NOTIFY: Y | REPLY | REPLY WITH QUOTE | PERMALINK | TOP | HOME
I'm really torn on the issue of gun control.
I simply do not want crazy people to has access to weaponry that have such final and dramatic results, they can change the course of a couple dozen lives in seconds.
On the other hand, I'd like to support the second amendment as written(and while I grant that it's open for interpretation, the most liberal interpretation is safest),
and in this case as in many, I believe the problem is less with the guns and more with our inability to adress the root of the issue, like poor education and little government assistance for troubled citizens, a generally poor support structure that is the byproduct of our society which cultivates so much alienation, etc.
but in the meantime what is the solution? Heh, as if we were on our way to some greater enlightenment. But given our current condition, and given the imbalanced ability of one man to destroy so much so quickly, I don't have a problem with the spirit of laws that regulate gun access based upon determined sanity, and maybe psychological evaluations...
which of course leads back to the other dangerous prospect that I think has been brought up before....who gets to decide sanity? Can such a process be used as a method of selective control over citizens more likely to be unruly? Maybe they could have a criteria within the test that says if applicant is unhappy with current administration, he is a risk to the community...etc. I'm being a little Hyperbolic sure, but I"m not sure by how much.
The only thing I can suggest, given my current understanding, is that we as citizens give support to our politicians to regulate guns based on the determined sanity of the applicants, but at the same time, we scrutinize diligently the criteria, the hiring process, and the science behind the decisions being made...so that we don't allow our representatives to disenfranchise our fellow citizens unduly. Of course our inability to pay attention is one of those other root problems at the heart of our American crisis.
Some middle ground has to be found on this one...both extremes are well...for once, extreme.
NOTIFY: Y | REPLY | REPLY WITH QUOTE | PERMALINK | TOP | HOME
"and the science behind the decisions being made"
FACT-based legislation ???? Oh dear me 
that's asking way too much.
***************************************************************
That would be like asking for treatment for drug offenders rather than jail, or legalizing marijuana, or mental health screening for convicted perps, or review of taser use, or police car cams ...
NOTIFY: N | REPLY | REPLY WITH QUOTE | PERMALINK | TOP | HOME
Quote:
Originally posted by citizen:
"Bear arms" at the time meant "serve in the military", not "own weapons". An arguably correct definition of the 2nd Amendment was allowing anyone to join the Militia, and keeping that Militia from being subject to control of the Federal government.
Seems to me that, historically, at that time, the Minutemen were still in everyone's memory, as was the fact that the new nation was still a frontier society, mostly. To have served in the militia would have meant keeping your gun in your home, and grabbing it and comin'a'runnin' when there was a problem.
That's what the Founding Fathers had experienced, and what they meant.
Times have changed, the situation has changed, maybe the Amendment needs to be changed, but that's what they meant.
NOTIFY: Y | REPLY | REPLY WITH QUOTE | PERMALINK | TOP | HOME
The FF were practical. They really tried to predict how any situation would play out, and forestall potential problems. There is such a thing as being so dogmatic over the particulars that you lose the intent, something I suspect the FF would not be happy to see.
***************************************************************
"Global warming - it's not just a fact, it's a choice."
NOTIFY: N | REPLY | REPLY WITH QUOTE | PERMALINK | TOP | HOME
Quote:That situation isn't anaglous to what there is now though.
Originally posted by NewOldBrownCoat:
Seems to me that, historically, at that time, the Minutemen were still in everyone's memory, as was the fact that the new nation was still a frontier society, mostly. To have served in the militia would have meant keeping your gun in your home, and grabbing it and comin'a'runnin' when there was a problem.
That's what the Founding Fathers had experienced, and what they meant.
Times have changed, the situation has changed, maybe the Amendment needs to be changed, but that's what they meant.
More insane ramblings by the people who brought you beeeer milkshakes!
No one can see their reflection in running water. It is only in still water that we can see.
NOTIFY: Y | REPLY | REPLY WITH QUOTE | PERMALINK | TOP | HOME
Quote:
Originally posted by NewOldBrownCoat:
Seems to me that, historically, at that time, the Minutemen were still in everyone's memory, as was the fact that the new nation was still a frontier society, mostly. To have served in the militia would have meant keeping your gun in your home, and grabbing it and comin'a'runnin' when there was a problem.
That's what the Founding Fathers had experienced, and what they meant.
Times have changed, the situation has changed, maybe the Amendment needs to be changed, but that's what they meant.
Shay's Rebellion was a more immediate concern then the legacy of the minutemen.
Yet despite the obvious threat to the State by armed citizens with a grievance, they chose to adopt the protection anyway trusting that a just government would have nothing to fear from its people.
H
NOTIFY: Y | REPLY | REPLY WITH QUOTE | PERMALINK | TOP | HOME
Quote:
Originally posted by citizen:
How many nuclear bombs do you have geezer? (I mean while we're using the slippery slope fallacy).
None, so far. I haven't found a use for one yet and they're sorta expensive to keep around 'just in case'.
I have found that while cooking I do tend to use a 10" chef's knife or utility knife quite a bit more than a short paring knife. Screwdrivers, saws, hammers, etc. come in handy from time to time as well. My rifle has filled my freezer with all-natural wild game, saving me the cost and risk of hormone-'enhanced' beef. They're all tools to me - ones that I need - and I get the best I can afford.
"Keep the Shiny side up"
NOTIFY: Y | REPLY | REPLY WITH QUOTE | PERMALINK | TOP | HOME
Righteous, I believe the best course of action is industry self-regulation - given current liability issues cause by sue-happy folk who are scared witless of a mere tool, it's in their own best interest to limit that liability by demanding some evidence of competence prior to sale.
Seriously, it's a simple, logical solution to many of the problems, have a list of inexpensive basic courses in firearm use and safety that meet the approval of said manufacturer and/or gun store, and require the certification from one of them as a condition of the sale, as is within the right of the businesses involved.
And perhaps offer a discount if one can provide a cert from a more involved/advanced training course, since those folk would have an even lower liability issue, you see.
Honestly, if you were going to buy a powerful tool that could harm or even kill you or someone else if mishandled - wouldn't you make sure you knew what the hell you were doing before you tried to use it ?
That also would keep the Governments filthy paws off the issue, cause they've proven, by the stepping stone analogy above, that they cannot br trusted with it.
Just to make sure no ambiguity exsists in my interpretation of the 2nd Amendment, I read it as thus, in modern interpretation and phrasing.
"The right of all people to own and carry with them, weapons - is inviolate and shall not in any way be hindered."
And for the "it'll never happen here!" folks, it did happen here, during Katrina - what is to say that such would not happen in case of a fire, flood, power outage or similar disaster in your town someday ?
Even so, I think people attach too much emotion and projected issues to what is a mere tool, an object without will or motivating force of it's own.
I keep a fire extinguisher, first aid kit, and a pistol handy, all for the exact same reason, to handle a situation while waiting for the professionals to get there and assist.
No one (yet) wants to ban the first aid kit, or the fire extinguisher... so from that viewpoint it's just damned silly, isn't it ?
-Frem
It cannot be said enough, those who do not learn from history, are doomed to endlessly repeat it
NOTIFY: N | REPLY | REPLY WITH QUOTE | PERMALINK | TOP | HOME
Out of curiosity Geeze, and yer not at all obligated to answer if you don't wanna...
What's yer preferred protein collection unit ?
One of my buddies has a right nice Tikka which for it's price impressed me quite a bit, and a couple of the shotgunners have some real nice kit.
I don't hunt per se, being hopeless with a rifle, but for a cut of the bagged game, I'll scout and find ya something to shoot, IF the folks involved meet my standards of basic safety and competency.
Of course that means they gotta actually keep up, and most of us are gettin a little too old and wheezy for that kinda thing anymore, not to mention being dubious of the safety standards of the younger crowd these days.
Tree stands and bait blocks are for lazy bums, lol.
-F
NOTIFY: N | REPLY | REPLY WITH QUOTE | PERMALINK | TOP | HOME