Time to bury the guns...
POSTED BY: Hardware
UPDATED: Thursday, October 11, 2007 15:32
VIEWED: 9033
PAGE 2 of 5
I said everybody, didn't I ?
When it comes right down to it - if you can't trust someone to not shoot folk, then why trust them to drive a car, own tools, etc ?
That's a damn short drop to a rubber room "for our own protection", and contrary to all that I believe.
And given the state of our current despotism, I am not at all prepared to accept their definition of "terrorist" or "mentally ill" - especially given a regime that seems to consider anything but absolute subservience to their merest whim, no matter how lunatic, to be one or the other.
And mostly certainly I would not accept your definition of a "convicted violent felon" given that you are, in essence, part of that regimes apparatus, no, I do not think so.
If one wishes to have and excercise a right, it must be universal - none of this denying it to people you do not like, that is the very essence of despotism, just like free speech, I may not like what someone says, but damned if I wanna shut them up - you start down that road, sooner or later it comes back to YOU.
The world is not a safe place, it cannot be made a safe place no matter how many rules and laws are enacted in a ludicrous effort to make it so - words on paper are no defense save after the fact, if even then, and be damned if I would meekly hand over the responsibility for my own safety to people (government) that have been endlessly proven to not be trustworthy with it, in exchange for a flawed illusion of safety that in truth constitutes no such thing.
To not carry a firearm because we have police is as insane, as asinine, as to not have a fire extinguisher because we have fire departments, a ridiculous concept when you strip away the fear of a mere tool and look at it for what it is.
-Frem
It cannot be said enough, those who do not learn from history, are doomed to endlessly repeat it
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Quote:
Originally posted by Hero:Quote:
Originally posted by Fremdfirma:
Meh, as folk know, I think everyone who wants one should have one -
Does that include terrorist, convicted violent felons, and the mentally ill? Cause if you agree we can't allow those folks to have guns then you agree we need gun control...just disagree as to the how much.
Me, I've got some nice guns, I intend to keep them whatever the law says. But I favor keeping them away from criminals, terrorists, and crazy types...and kids (without proper supervision, which means most kids these days, but not all).
H
I've proposed a compromise in the past for this one - what if we redesigned the interface on those machines that we all have to use to legally purchase a firearm so that it only takes our name and social and then connects to the FBI crime database, which thanks to the Patriot Act can now be interconnected to other GO's databases like mental hospitals, and the machine can give you a thumbs up or down right on the spot. And of course this would rescind the NFA of 1934 and all of it's amendments, which would allow anybody of age to buy anything provided the system didn't flag them. And just to calm down the libs now that we would be able to buy machine guns over the counter without massive months of bureaucracy and fees we would even have a waiting period for a *first* gun purchase, because logically after that if the person can't use the second gun they will just use the first.
I’m never serious. Serious means something bad is about to happen.
98% of teens have smoked pot, if you are one of the 2% that haven't, copy this into your signature
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Quote:Amen.
I said everybody, didn't I ?
Can't Take My Gorram Sky
--------------
Aude sapere (Dare to know). -- Samuel Hahnemann, M.D.
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Quote:
Originally posted by Fremdfirma:
I said everybody, didn't I ?
When it comes right down to it - if you can't trust someone to not shoot folk, then why trust them to drive a car, own tools, etc ?
I think thats the point in restricting them.
Because a terrorist and a violent criminal or a person who's criminally insane...you can't really trust them not to shoot folk.
And I oppose allowing terrorists to drive, own tools, etc. I'm funny that way, being all biased against the terrorists.
The Constitution is not a suicide pact...Supreme Court said that cause some of you folk are perfectly happy to be dead rather then bend just a little on issues like allowing terrorists and crazy types to buy guns. Thats fine for you, not for me, and not for the majority of folks around.
Its live free or die. Not Die free cause you allowed a terrorist to kill you with a legally purchased firearm. Me, I'd let all you law abiding folks buy anything you want within reason (no nukes...and you need to have a really good reason for a bazooka, like varmint huntin). Its the bad guys and the crazy guys whose rights don't mean squat to me.
H
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Quote:
Originally posted by Hero:
And I oppose allowing terrorists to drive, own tools, etc. I'm funny that way, being all biased against the terrorists.
You're a horrible person, being all biased against people who want to kill you. Shame.
"It's better to have a gun and not need it, than to need a gun and not have it." - "True Romance"
A man who walks the Earth
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If someone tries to take away our right to bear arms, then- just on principal- I'll get one of my crazier (And more millitant friends) to shoot them. Prople repect what they fear, people fear what they respect. It's a vicious cycle that led us to not be a colony anymore.
-Danny
We move for all mankind,
A million miles from everything we've ever know...
We're on their hearts and minds,
A million heads are bowed to bring us safely home...
Hemmed in by emptiness,
A million ways that everything could be undone...
THRICE RULES!!!!!!!!!
http://www.myspace.com/otherrandomdude
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Quote:And I'm finding myself stuck dead in the middle between you two; I'm starting to agree with Frem we must question who is deciding who the terrorists are and agreeing with Hero I don't want 'em to have none.
Originally posted by Hero:Quote:
Originally posted by Fremdfirma:
I said everybody, didn't I ?
When it comes right down to it - if you can't trust someone to not shoot folk, then why trust them to drive a car, own tools, etc ?
I think thats the point in restricting them.
Because a terrorist and a violent criminal or a person who's criminally insane...you can't really trust them not to shoot folk.
And I oppose allowing terrorists to drive, own tools, etc. I'm funny that way, being all biased against the terrorists.
...
Its live free or die. Not Die free cause you allowed a terrorist to kill you with a legally purchased firearm. Me, I'd let all you law abiding folks buy anything you want within reason (no nukes...and you need to have a really good reason for a bazooka, like varmint huntin). Its the bad guys and the crazy guys whose rights don't mean squat to me.
Of course, no one said was fair. Or simple.
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Quote:
Originally posted by Fremdfirma:
I said everybody, didn't I ?
When it comes right down to it - if you can't trust someone to not shoot folk, then why trust them to drive a car, own tools, etc ?
Regarding the mentally ill, many of them that shouldn't have guns wouldn't be capable of passing a driving test, so no we don't let them drive.
Regarding cars in general I find your analogy flawed, most people require transportation in order to have gainful employment, denying them the ability to drive denies them the ability to lead a productive life. Denying the right to have guns can, under certain circumstances, do the same, however the circumstances in question are much rarer and typically easier to avoid. A maniac with a car can certainly kill, but not as efficiently as a maniac with a gun. Additionally a person with significant driving infractions will have their license revoked, a violent criminal is in essence having their license revoked the same way.
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I ain't buyin what you're sellin.
Firstoff, a criminal, especially a known violent felon with no respect for the law in the first place, isn't gonna give a rats ass if some words on paper say he cannot have a gun.
Do you really, truly, honestly THINK that will stop him like a brick wall from buying or possessing one ?
Cause that's what you're trying to sell me, here.
Imma also refer you to this post, that whole totally pesky "unalienable rights" thing, you know.
http://www.fireflyfans.net/thread.asp?b=18&t=30821&m=547245#547245
And on top of that, what part of "shall not be infringed" somehow escaped folk here ?
I don't see any caveats, exceptions, excuses or legal/verbal contortions there, I see a plain statement that means exactly what the hell it says, and it's a damned slippery slope when you start letting the Gov slip it's leash.
A universal right must remain universal, otherwise it's just one group oppressing another.
-Frem
It cannot be said enough, those who do not learn from history, are doomed to endlessly repeat it
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Quote:
Originally posted by Alliethorn7:
If someone tries to take away our right to bear arms, then- just on principal- I'll get one of my crazier (And more millitant friends) to shoot them. Prople repect what they fear, people fear what they respect. It's a vicious cycle that led us to not be a colony anymore.
-Danny
I take issue with this statement. In my many years, I have found that people fear what they fear and respect the righteous. Fear in no way can be confused with respect. Respect can only be earned - neither given or forced.
Don't get someone else too do your own dirty work - Comes a time you have to shoot your own dog. Don't farm it out. It only makes it worse.
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