BBC bias
POSTED BY: kaneman
UPDATED: Saturday, November 4, 2006 05:17
VIEWED: 5882
PAGE 5 of 7
Quote:The BBC is a Public sponsored corporation. It is paid for by the TV licence.
Originally posted by FellowTraveler:
Could it be that, for the most part, American broadcasters are biased towards money and that is acceptable, even encouraged, over here.
Where as the BBC is much like PBS, right? Some kinda' hybrid, semi-public, semi-state owned corporation?
The BBC does make profits from sale of footage, programs, DVD etc., but I believe the proceeds from this are, by law, prevented from being used to pay for news services or programming, at least within British Territories. I assume things like BBC America and possibly the world service could be funded by advertising revenue and/or merchandise sales, but to be honest I really don't know.
The idea is that for vital media such as news those that hold the purse strings can have no say in what the BBC News service reports. It's not a bad idea really, I can't see a corporate owned news service reporting a story that questions the parent company and possibly effects their profits, but since BBC news income is protected by law they are free to question even those that hold the purse strings.
I think this was proved involving a motoring program top gear sometime ago. They had some rather unkind statements to the effect of "this new Peugeot is crap" which Peugeot weren't happy with. They demanded that the segment be removed or they'd stop advertising with the BBC, the BBC said "Okay, we don't run adverts".
Of course Top Gear isn't news per se, but the basic idea holds up I think.
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Quote:
Originally posted by citizen:
You obviously missed it first time round so I'll restate it:
Nothing here is talking about the BBC's news coverage. That is this bias is about the BBC television programming, with specifically room 101 as a comedy show, not a news program, that's the bias they're talking about. Nothing to do with their journalism, so why, despite me pointing it out twice before and a third time here do you continue to say otherwise?
From (emphasis added)
http://www.thisislondon.co.uk/news/article-23371617-details/We+are+bia
sed%252C+admit+the+stars+of+BBC+News/article.do
Quote:
Political pundit(edit:And BBC journalist) Andrew Marr said: 'The BBC is not impartial or neutral. It's a publicly funded, urban organisation with an abnormally large number of young people, ethnic minorities and gay people. It has a liberal bias not so much a party-political bias. It is better expressed as a cultural liberal bias.'
Washington correspondent Justin Webb said that the BBC is so biased against America that deputy director general Mark Byford had secretly agreed to help him to 'correct', it in his reports. Webb added that the BBC treated America with scorn and derision and gave it 'no moral weight'.
Former BBC business editor Jeff Randall said he complained to a 'very senior news executive', about the BBC's pro-multicultural stance but was given the reply: 'The BBC is not neutral in multiculturalism: it believes in it and it promotes it.'
Head of news Helen Boaden disclosed that a Radio 4 programme which blamed black youths at a young offenders', institution for bullying white inmates faced the axe until she stepped in.
Perhaps you should actually read the article I linked prior to spouting off about it. There is plenty of discussion, in the article, about the news operation.
Quote:
Originally posted by citizen:
Please tell me that you don't equate having a point of view with torturing another human being?
No, and you know it. You're just trying to change the subject. And it's interesting how bias in broadcasting has drifted into the benign "having a point of view." So I guess Fox isn't that bad, since they just have a point of view?
Quote:
Originally posted by citizen:
Their news reporting is still uncoloured by political and economic pressures, unlike their contemporaries.
Not according to their newspeople, as noted above.
Quote:
Originally posted by citizen:
Careful, I'm not the one twisting evidence into something it isn't, i.e. I'm not the one equating the content of a comedy program with the content of a news service.
Neither am I. I'm the one actually reading the statements by newspeople about bias in the news organization and managing to avoid going off half-cocked.
"Keep the Shiny side up"
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Quote:Actually dear you're the one who pulled torture into the mix, not me. You changed the subject I replied.
Originally posted by Geezer:
No, and you know it. You're just trying to change the subject. And it's interesting how bias in broadcasting has drifted into the benign "having a point of view." So I guess Fox isn't that bad, since they just have a point of view?
But we're still on the "having a bias is the same as torture" nonsense dressed up convieniently as apparently my problem for not accepting that.
Ok, I suppose it's okay for me to torture you, since it's the same thing as having a bias, how's a week next tuesday for you? What do you want first the stress position or the Iron Maiden?
And as I already said and you continue to ignore the BBC of course has bias, everyone has bias, point of view is part of that. It's unreasonable to expect different, or down right dishonest.
Quote:You're the one being intentionally baiting and intentionally attempting to paint the BBC as the most bias source, for reasons known only to yourself.
I'm the one actually reading the statements by newspeople about bias in the news organization and managing to avoid going off half-cocked.
Yeah the BBC is biased, I said that from the off, all news sources are and no source can not be, that's the why you should look at different sources, preferably higher quality ones, which doesn't include FOX news, and does include the BBC and Reuters as two examples.
Also I was replying to you, not the artical, and the only thing you've had to say on the subject so far was:
Quote:equating a comedy show to be the same as a news service.
"In one of a series of discussions, executives were asked to rule on how they would react if the controversial comedian Sacha Baron Cohen ) known for his offensive characters Ali G and Borat - was a guest on the programme Room 101.
On the show, celebrities are invited to throw their pet hates into a dustbin and it was imagined that Baron Cohen chose some kosher food, the Archbishop of Canterbury, a Bible and the Koran.
Nearly everyone at the summit, including the show's actual producer and the BBC's head of drama, Alan Yentob, agreed they could all be thrown into the bin, except the Koran for fear of offending Muslims."
This does seem to convey an impression of either bias or cowardice.
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Quote:
Originally posted by citizen:
Actually dear you're the one who pulled torture into the mix, not me. You changed the subject I replied.
No. Just applying reducto ad absurdum to your contention that "if everyone does it, it must be all right."
Quote:
You're the one being intentionally baiting and intentionally attempting to paint the BBC as the most bias source, for reasons known only to yourself.
If you can provide any quote that indicates that I am "...intentionally attempting to paint the BBC as the most bias source." please do so. I am saying that they are biased, you apparently agree (see below). I respect them as a news source, so I'm more disappointed than I would be if,say, the Washington Times admitted they might show bias.
Quote:
Yeah the BBC is biased, I said that from the off, all news sources are and no source can not be, that's the why you should look at different sources, preferably higher quality ones, which doesn't include FOX news, and does include the BBC and Reuters as two examples.
Also I was replying to you, not the artical
If you're not going to take the time to read the background information on which the entire thread was based, maybe you shouldn't play.
"Keep the Shiny side up"
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Quote:I never said it was all right, I said the continuing posturing by certain people here that makes out that the BBC is somehow the worst culprit, and that it is entirely possible for anyone to not be at all biased is crap.
Originally posted by Geezer:
No. Just applying reducto ad absurdum to your contention that "if everyone does it, it must be all right."
So geezer you say torture and bias are equivelent, which you use as proof that what I say false, it's still a logical fallacy.
If you can't stop lying and intentionally trying to wind people up with your petty wise cracks maybe you shouldn't play.
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So, maybe comparing the BBC (news) to NBC, ABC, FOX, etc, isn't really fair. They're not playing on the same field. The news divisions of US broadcasters have been somewhat reduced to line items on a P&L. One could argue that objectivity is now a close second to ad. sales and profitability. And info-tainment is born.
Perhaps a more apt comparison would be the BBC and PBS (or NPR) and interestingly, both often face the same accusations of a leftist slant.
In the case of our public broadcasters, I can begrudgingly admit that the accusations are well founded, though conservative contempt for everything thats purpose isn't profit might exacerbate their ire.
But, so what? What the Hell is wrong with a little (obvious) bias? Even if all the accusations are correct, it's not like the BBC (or PBS) is advocating genocide, or child molestation, or suicide bombings. Aren't tolerance and multi-culturalism good things?
As to the most most damning accusations to us Americans, those of anti-Americanism and treating Islam with more respect than Christianity, our broadcasters rountinely behave similarly.
Just a few short years ago, was there not a palpable anti-French/anti-German atmoshpere all over American television? Is not being called French the equivalent to being called a pussy? How many times were those Danish Mohammed cartoons shown on TV? But, material that Christians find offensive is shown with some regularity, right?
I think we've got a little pot & kettle thing going here...
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Quote:I think that is sentiment similar to what I was trying to say.
Originally posted by FellowTraveler:
I think we've got a little pot & kettle thing going here...
Though the anti-American thing I really don't get. Whether this is feeling held by those in the BBC I certainly have never seen it in the news programming.
But I'm still not seeing any real bias in the news programming. There's some mention of News readers possibly being allowed to where veils but not Christian crosses, which depending on situation could be a bias (I refer to the recent thing with BA being accused of bias because they didn't give preferential treatment to a Christian wishing to wear her Jewellery), is hardly a bias in news reporting. The only real biases in news reporting raised here seem to be anti-Americanism and the threat to possibly maybe remove a non-news current events program from BBC Radio 4. The first I'm not sure of it's reality and the second is not actual news and it wasn't pulled anyway. So the obvious incredible bias being pointed to here seems so far to have had zero effect on the end news product.
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Quote:
Originally posted by citizen:Quote:I never said it was all right...
Originally posted by Geezer:
No. Just applying reducto ad absurdum to your contention that "if everyone does it, it must be all right."
In answer to my question, "Is the BBC Biased"
Citizen:"Of course they are. Everyone is."
Sure seems to excuse them of bias, since "everyone is".
Quote:
I said the continuing posturing by certain people here that makes out that the BBC is somehow the worst culprit...
And I once again ask you to provide one quote in this thread indicating that BBC is "the worst culprit".
Quote:
So geezer you say torture and bias are equivelent, which you use as proof that what I say false, it's still a logical fallacy.
...or a quote stating I think torture and bias are equivalent.
Quote:
If you can't stop lying and intentionally trying to wind people up with your petty wise cracks maybe you shouldn't play.
Hmm, you're the one claiming I state, "...that the BBC is somehow the worst culprit." and that "... torture and bias are equivelent." Both demonstrably lies to anyone who takes the time to read this entire thread.
Sorry, Citizen, you're just making smoke and firing chaff to try and make a clean getaway.
"Keep the Shiny side up"
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Quote:Is this where I scream at you or something? Just tell me when you want me to embaress myself by losing my temper at your baiting, ok?
Originally posted by Geezer:Quote:
Originally posted by citizen:Quote:I never said it was all right...
Originally posted by Geezer:
No. Just applying reducto ad absurdum to your contention that "if everyone does it, it must be all right."
In answer to my question, "Is the BBC Biased"
Citizen:"Of course they are. Everyone is."
Sure seems to excuse them of bias, since "everyone is".Quote:
I said the continuing posturing by certain people here that makes out that the BBC is somehow the worst culprit...
And I once again ask you to provide one quote in this thread indicating that BBC is "the worst culprit".Quote:
So geezer you say torture and bias are equivelent, which you use as proof that what I say false, it's still a logical fallacy.
...or a quote stating I think torture and bias are equivalent.Quote:
If you can't stop lying and intentionally trying to wind people up with your petty wise cracks maybe you shouldn't play.
Hmm, you're the one claiming I state, "...that the BBC is somehow the worst culprit." and that "... torture and bias are equivelent." Both demonstrably lies to anyone who takes the time to read this entire thread.
Sorry, Citizen, you're just making smoke and firing chaff to try and make a clean getaway.
"Keep the Shiny side up"
Or.
Maybe we can start again, how's that. So What's this mean to you? We agree that the BBC has bias, lets go from there.
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Quote:
Originally posted by citizen:
Maybe we can start again, how's that. So What's this mean to you? We agree that the BBC has bias, lets go from there.
That's pretty much all that I said, that the BBC seems to have admitted that they have certain biases. If the London Calling article I linked to is to be believed, (I have no reason to doubt it), Some of their senior news staff believe this has an impact on their news coverage, at least of the US. They also seem to be more concerned about offending Muslims than Christians, at least on some of their non-news shows. I'm disappointed, because I have always considered BBC News a pretty authoritative source, and wish they didn't have any bias to be concerned about.
I doubt (and never said) that they have any more bias than any other news organization. I recognise that they have less than many. This does not absolve them from censure for having bias.
Now, if you would kindly ask your attack dog to remove his jaws from my ankle
, we could have a civilized discussion about media outlets and standards for news reporting. Perhaps tomorrow, as it approaches bedtime for aged Geezers."Keep the Shiny side up"
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