Unemployment rate hits 5-month high
POSTED BY: FellowTraveler
UPDATED: Wednesday, August 9, 2006 21:39
VIEWED: 7321
PAGE 2 of 11
Quote:If it dies, it'll be from TRSitius, not you Signy.
Originally posted by SignyM:
Just to make sure that this isn't a self-slected population, time-series studies also show that economies improve AFTER an increase in the minimum wage... not before.
So.... I hope I didn't kill this thread.
Does a raise in minium wage stimulate spending into the economy? It seems like it would have the effect of slowing job growth a little...
Just askin' Chrisisall
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Raising minimum wage slow job growth??? Not at all....
The minimum wage is fertilizer for the economy because it sets the stage for higher demand, which means higher production and job expansion. (With caveats about where those jobs are created.) It's a positive feedback loop.
Oppositely, less demand means layoffs, which means less demand.... w/o attention, this can lead to a runaway crash (a la the Great Depression). Henry Ford saw this dynamic very clearly. Even as others were shuttering their businesses, he kept his going until he ran out of money, because he saw that the unemployed don't buy. It was the right idea, but his company wasn't anywhere near big enough to solve the problem.
"Monetary" policy- ie setting interest rates... is a very broad-brush solution for a specific problem. Government FISCAL policy (reduce deficit spending) combined with WAGE policy (increase minimum wage) is a much more targeted approach to stagflation. But fiscal and wage policy are not in the Fed's purview... that rests with the President and Congress. Given that they seem to be deliberately trying to suck the middle class dry, I don't see any help from that direciton.
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Reality sucks. Especially when it contradicts our cherished ideas.
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Quote:
Originally posted by BigDamnNobody:Quote:
Originally posted by chrisisall:
Again???!
It's been done, BDN, please give it a rest, okay?
Look, I'm no fan, but it gets old, aiight?
Let's just explore the effects or causes or whatever. We can bash the admin. on plenty of other threads.
That is what I was attempting to do by asking FellowTraveler the point behind his/her post. My apologies if I was mistaken regarding your response. Perhaps, when you mentioned 'some people', you were simply refering to an aquaintance of yours in the energy sector who thinks the economy is booming.
What is your opinion on the causes or effects or whatever?
De-lurking to clear stuff up.
Not much of point. Capital is doing well, Labor is doing poorly, which is the intended consequence of supply side economics.
Not making a moral judgement. I do work, but also have investments (God bless that Exxon stock). So, like most other middle class Americans (I suspect), I'm doing well and getting screwed...
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Quote:
Originally posted by SignyM:
There are a lot of ways to do this, and one of the BEST ways is to raise the minimum wage (which hasn't been raised over 10 years).
Yep. Too bad the Dems voted it down in the Senate yesterday. Guess they'd rather penalize the 26,000 sub-$5 million estates per year that end up paying about $6 billion in estate tax, rather than see that two million+ minimum wage workers get increased pay.
Did you realize that the total Estate tax collected in 2004 (last year for which IRS figures are available) was just $21.5 billion? Now figure the tax benefits (not to mention the social benefits) of having two million people earning an extra $2.10 and hour ($80.40 a week, $4,000.00 a year). Seems like a fair tradeoff to me.
"Keep the Shiny side up"
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Quote:Like Willow might say raising her hand:
Originally posted by SignyM:
Raising minimum wage slow job growth??? Not at all....
Not an economist!
Thanks for helping me (and the rest of the econonomics-challenged) understand a little better.
Always learning, not always retaining Chrisisall
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Quote:
Originally posted by BigDamnNobody:
Oh I see, instead of an economic discussion this is simply another bash the present administration and it's supporters thread.
Quote:
Originally posted by chrisisall:
Actually, I was referring to peeps around here that use the 'booming economy' point to underscore what a good job a certain President is doing.
Must be why you are considered 'unofficial moderator'.
De-lurking to stir stuff up.
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Quote:
Originally posted by Geezer:
Yep. Too bad the Dems voted it down in the Senate yesterday. Guess they'd rather penalize the 26,000 sub-$5 million estates per year that end up paying about $6 billion in estate tax, rather than see that two million+ minimum wage workers get increased pay.
Did you realize that the total Estate tax collected in 2004 (last year for which IRS figures are available) was just $21.5 billion? Now figure the tax benefits (not to mention the social benefits) of having two million people earning an extra $2.10 and hour ($80.40 a week, $4,000.00 a year). Seems like a fair tradeoff to me.
Why couple the two?
Why not have an up and down vote on a minimum wage increase?
Why not have an up and down vote on repealing the estate tax?
We both know the answer to that question. The Republicans want to have something they can use against the Democrats going into the midterms. And they figured they might, just might, have a shot at that estate-tax-repealing-wet-dream that has been plaguing their nights for the longest time.
Is there any other reason to couple the two? It's not like the people who died are now going to have to pay their workers more because the minimum wage went up.
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Quote:LOL. Thank you Sig.
Originally posted by SignyM:
"Divergers welcome!"
Unfortunately, I am so ignorant about this topic I'm just here to lurk and learn.
(Squatting with a bucket of popcorn.)
Can't Take My Gorram Sky
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Geezer, cutting taxes and raising minimum wages are not the equivalent items and they really don't belong together. Cutting taxes removes several billions of dollars from the budget, but raising the minimum wage doesn't replace that revenue stream and it doesn't directly transfer benefit to minimum-wage workers.
As an aside, in addition to raising the minimum wage (which would increase purchasing power by about 4-6 billion over three years) the government could effectively raise ALL wages by providing single-payer health care. That would not only provide a significant relief to businesses, which are being bled dry by their business buddy- the health insurance sector- it would effectively raise the wages of people who currently do not have insurance. It would also cut total medical care costs by about 30% by eliminating administrative costs (borne by hospitals, medical offices, testing labs etc as they navigate their way thru complex insurance paperwork) and an additional 10% by eliminating insurance company profits.
BTW_ Geezer- How DO you get your logic to be so.... twisty??? You must work at it AWFULLY hard!!!
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Reality sucks. Especially when it contradicts our cherished ideas.
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Quote:
Originally posted by SignyM:
So while the Feds may wring their hands and look helpless about the problem, the solution is readily at hand... just fatally unpopular with the current administration and Congress. The solution is to end deficit spending and redirect money back into the larger economy. There are a lot of ways to do this, and one of the BEST ways is to raise the minimum wage (which hasn't been raised over 10 years).
I wouldn't go so far as to say fatally unpopular.
http://www.republicanmainstreet.org/news072806.htm
De-lurking to stir stuff up.
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