Simon and Kaylee - Meant to last or meant to not?

POSTED BY: TamSibling
UPDATED: Thursday, February 16, 2006 22:14
VIEWED: 8429
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MILFORD

Tuesday, February 14, 2006 2:14 PM

Come on, you all know exactly what would happen. Of course Simon and Kaylee are great and perfect for each other. But remember that this is a Joss Whedon show, which means that Simon would end up shooting Kaylee, or something else totally unexpected, like Simon getting shot with a Reaver harpoon.

Thier happiness wouldn't last in the Whedonverse because conflict is ultimately more interesting than contentment.

Like the rest of you, I'm excited to see what Joss does with this WHEN we get our SERIES back from the black abyss of ignorance.

Remember, that but for one trifling exception, the entire universe is made up of others.- Oliver Wendall Holmes

GWEK

Tuesday, February 14, 2006 3:17 PM

Simon and Kaylee work only on the carefully constructed world of Serenity. Off the ship, they belong in one another's worlds no more than Inara and Mal do in each other's.

As long as their fugitives on the run, and stuck aboard the same ship, they've got a good chance to stay together, but as soon as some of that tension is off, the difference in their worlds will tear them apart. In "Shindig" and "Safe", respectively, we get to see what happens when Kaylee enters Simon's "world" and when Simon enter's Kaylee's. Ain't neither thing too pretty.

Heap onto that Simon's responsibilities toward River, which will be ever-changing and never really go away, and you've got a recipe for folks who're are going to drift apart despite their best intentions.

They're a cute couple, and they're a fun "underdog couple" to root for, but there's no doubt in my mind that, when the show continues, they won't get more than a season or two of together time. Of, if things continue as movies, I think we'll see one of them as the next casualty.

This is Whedon, after all, and Whedon hates love.

MILFORD

Tuesday, February 14, 2006 3:24 PM

Quote:
This is Whedon, after all, and Whedon hates love.

Too true! You know it's not going to last, because the loves that last are few and far between. There's too much shifting and complexity in life to simply fall for the first red-headed mechanic that comes along. The pressures that threw them together will eventually pull them apart. In the FF/S world, only Zoe and Wash's love was forvever I think. Mal and Inara are too proud to actually love each other. And since Wash, well, you know, I don't think Zoe loves again. Then again, we are talking about Mr. Whedon, the man who gave us the pregnant vampire and other foolishness. Probably, WHEN the series starts up again, Zoe will end up with Simon, Kaylee will join the Alliance, Mal will fall in love with her since he loves to love what he can't have, River will become a companion, Inara will be captain of the ship, and Jayne will run for Parliment.

By the way, what an appropriate topic for Valentine's Day.

Remember, that but for one trifling exception, the entire universe is made up of others.- Oliver Wendall Holmes

GWEK

Tuesday, February 14, 2006 3:32 PM

I think a lot of it (and who winds up with who) really depends on the direction of the show. For example, if everyone stays on the ship, various couples DO have a bit of a chance, but if they don't, I would ultimately seen Simon and Inara together on a Core World somewhere, while Mal and Kaylee end up married and raising a gaggle of kids on Serenity. Of course, that's at the end of Season Seven, after the second war, and there's be lots of twists and turns to get there... And might be a little too obvious!

As someone posted in another thread, recently, who would POSSIBLY had predicted the romantic twists on Buffy/Angel? Willow dating a lesbian Slayerette? Buffy and Spike? Angel falling for Cordy? Xander engaged to a demon? (Well, okay, that one, sure).

www.stillflying.net: "Here's how it might have been..."

MILFORD

Tuesday, February 14, 2006 3:36 PM

That's true. I know Buffy and Angel constantly took me by surprise. My wife was always rooting for Wes and Fred to get together, because you just knew they would. Then, when they do, she's eated up inside by a giganto demon. Never saw it coming.

By the way, I like the arc of season seven, sounds like a good HALFWAY mark for the series. Just think, after fourteen years of Firefly back on TV they can make a final movie about all the old characters called SENILIYT.

Remember, that but for one trifling exception, the entire universe is made up of others.- Oliver Wendall Holmes

AGENTROUKA

Tuesday, February 14, 2006 3:48 PM

Quote:
Originally posted by GWEK:
while Mal and Kaylee end up married and raising a gaggle of kids on Serenity.

*cringe*

He calls her mei-mei!! He treats her like a daughter, almost.

What would young and blooming Kaylee want with someone like Mal, who's old beyond his years and paternally pets her head like she's a German Shepherd? She needs someone to start out life with, not retire.

What would layered cynic Mal want with an open book of a child-woman who follows his every command without question? He needs an emotional resting place, not a playback of every youthful illusion he's already rejected.

*shudder*

Much as it pains me, but Mal ending up in an undeveloping, mirror-image, two-rebellous-people-with-nowhere-to-go relationship with River seems more like to me than destroying that beautiful rewarding friendship between him and Kaylee.

GWEK

Tuesday, February 14, 2006 3:49 PM

I think Whedon's sort of stated that his intention was for "Firefly" to go seven seasons (giving some indication of the number of stories he had to tell). Of course, there's no reason those characters might not continue for another in a spin-off! Seven years in the black, seven years in the Core Worlds, say? Has a certain symmetry, no?

www.stillflying.net: "Here's how it might have been..."

GWEK

Tuesday, February 14, 2006 3:54 PM

Everyone's got their own opinions and viewpoints, and, really, I'm not saying that I'm a Mal-Kaylee fan or anything, just that I could see it happening. As for the details--See the above statement about how Whedon continually surprised us during Buffy and Angel with pairing that initially seemed very unlikely.

Also, look at it from this point of view: Kaylee is already maternal toward Serenity, so it's going to take a lot of her to leave the ship. The ship, to Mal, represents independence, so he's never going to leave it. Of the crew we know now, they're gonna be the last two onboard. Together, the captain/pilot and first-mate/mechanic are all you'd need to keep flyin'...

MILFORD

Tuesday, February 14, 2006 4:02 PM

True, and insightful. The common bond of the love for Serenity could be the avenue needed to match them up and keep them together.

As for AGENTROUKA's comments about the paternal nature of Mal towards Kaylee, haven't you ever noticed someone under your nose for the first time? I remember the first time I noticed a friend's bratty sister I had grown up with was actually an attractive girl. Talk about conflict. Anyhoo, I think it's a mistake to interpret Kaylee's optimism and enthusiasim for simplemindedness. Many people I know, like my wife for example, are enthusiastic and trusting purposfully, not unknowingly or because of a lack of experience. In fact, it's usually in an effort to offest pessimism and cynicism that surrounds them. We have a mistaken assumption that cynics are somehow more enlightened, which is a mistake. But that's off-topic. To sum up: Mal and Kaylee could make perfect sense, which means that they will never get together. The only sense in Whedon's world is non-sense. Whatever you think is coming you're wrong. As the Book said about the Operative, they'll come at you from the side. Just like Joss. And isn't that why he's the shiniest of them all?

Remember, that but for one trifling exception, the entire universe is made up of others.- Oliver Wendall Holmes

AGENTROUKA

Tuesday, February 14, 2006 4:52 PM

Quote:
Originally posted by milford:
True, and insightful. The common bond of the love for Serenity could be the avenue needed to match them up and keep them together.

But isn't that a little... little to keep two people together? What about them as individuals? What connects them? Seems more like sex out of convenience if it's because these two stay aboard the ship the longest.

Quote:

Anyhoo, I think it's a mistake to interpret Kaylee's optimism and enthusiasim for simplemindedness. Many people I know, like my wife for example, are enthusiastic and trusting purposfully, not unknowingly or because of a lack of experience. In fact, it's usually in an effort to offest pessimism and cynicism that surrounds them. We have a mistaken assumption that cynics are somehow more enlightened, which is a mistake. But that's off-topic.

You misunderstood me. I never said that Kaylee is in any way simple-minded. I said she is an open book and an optimist to the point of illusion. That's very different.

She's smart and a character with depth, but she is not the sort of challenging personality that would keep Mal's attention, I think. He knows Kaylee because at her best she lets everything show and he's very good at reading people. He can easily manipulate her, just like a father can easily manipulate his children for their own good. (See "Out Of Gas".)

Where's the sense of continued discovery that keeps a relationship interesting? The sense of equality?

She reacts to him like a girl to an adult, not like a woman to a man. When she speaks up to him it's either indirect and avoidant ("Shindig") or in a somewhat whiny complaint style (the movie). They inhabit an unequal social status on the ship, be it with regards to age, education, experience or downright position of authority.

For Kaylee to grow into a woman who could begin to match Mal in personal strength, she'd have to lose a lot of what makes her Kaylee right now, she'd have to become someone else.

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