Imponderables: Under The Mistletoe

POSTED BY: nvghostrider
UPDATED: Wednesday, December 31, 2008 13:31
VIEWED: 10713
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NVGHOSTRIDER

Wednesday, December 17, 2008 5:05 PM

Thread Previous:
http://www.fireflyfans.net/mthread.asp?b=2&t=35883&m=661885#top

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The country is making a big mistake not teaching kids to cook and raise a garden and build fires.
-Loretta Lynn

FREELANCERTEX

Wednesday, December 17, 2008 5:46 PM

FIRSTIES!!! *does firsties dance*

Quote:
Originally posted by MsA: FLT chocolate is poisonous for dogs... you need to take him to the vet or he can suffer heart damage ...hugs

I know @_@ my brilliant parents seem to keep assuming theyre hiding it well enough, but his old nose is way too smart for that. he's okay now, stomached some food, keepin it down, keepin water down too which he couldn't before >< problem is the vets close early here, which is *before* the rents get outta work. judging from what they charged the last time thumper was deathly ill, i wouldn't be able to settle the bill myself if they had to treat him for sumthin ><;; poor old man :\

well it's wednesday ^_^ week's half over, how's everyone feel about that?

MSA

Wednesday, December 17, 2008 8:10 PM

Well since I get to work from home the next two days... yippeee for Wednesday:)

Ok por little guy...very neglectful parents. Always "forget" to send him with hot lunch money and pack him a half assed lunch. Todays was a perviously opened string cheese ( not refrigerated so we had to toss it) a pb&j that looks like the bread was old and they just dumped some jelly on and then threw some peanutbutter in the middle.. more a wad than a sandwich.

To love someone is to see a miracle invisible to others.
--Francois Mauriac
It's fuzzy-minded liberal thinking like that that gets you eaten.

FREELANCERTEX

Wednesday, December 17, 2008 10:18 PM

WOOT

aw..that's just wrong. theres nuthin that can be done about it? i mean, giving a kid nasty unedible food has to be tantamount to starvation O_o or some horrible thing like that >.<

MSA

Wednesday, December 17, 2008 11:28 PM

ok I can officially beat that... one of the kids who is very fragile emotionally was looking forward to his mom actually being there for Christmas ( grandma has custody) today during lunch she shows up, present in hand. She's there to watch him open it 'cause she's decided to go with her friends instead of coming over for Christmas. Kid opens gift, mom says " ok hug me bye and I'll see you soon or something" kid hugs mom and she practically runs out the door. Kid turns to me and says " see I told you there's no such thing as Santa"... by the way the kid is 9.

To love someone is to see a miracle invisible to others.
--Francois Mauriac
It's fuzzy-minded liberal thinking like that that gets you eaten.

NVGHOSTRIDER

Thursday, December 18, 2008 12:26 AM

I'd gladly put the boots to her and her friends.

RAWWWRRRR!!!

Those are the kind of people I'd gladly consider committing a heresy upon.

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The country is making a big mistake not teaching kids to cook and raise a garden and build fires.
-Loretta Lynn

FREELANCERTEX

Thursday, December 18, 2008 1:25 AM

Quote:
Originally posted by MsA: one of the kids who is very fragile emotionally was looking forward to his mom actually being there for Christmas ( grandma has custody) today during lunch she shows up, present in hand. She's there to watch him open it 'cause she's decided to go with her friends instead of coming over for Christmas. Kid opens gift, mom says " ok hug me bye and I'll see you soon or something" kid hugs mom and she practically runs out the door. Kid turns to me and says " see I told you there's no such thing as Santa"... by the way the kid is 9.

Oh. My. God. what the fuck is wrong with people? How does she qualify as a mother? oh. thats right. a womb. that would be her *sole* qualification ><

my mother would gladly beat that chick senseless if she saw or heard of that happening.

lolz I'm with u NV. id have no reservations about telling some absolutely horrible rumors XD not heresy maybe, but rumors. theyre fun

MSA

Thursday, December 18, 2008 4:19 PM

yup as she dashed the aide (Ryan) muttered " bitch better run"

Luckily that happened to be the day that all of us had chosen to give the kids the presents we had purchased 'cause we knew his grandmother wouldn't be able to get him much.

To love someone is to see a miracle invisible to others.
--Francois Mauriac
It's fuzzy-minded liberal thinking like that that gets you eaten.

FREELANCERTEX

Thursday, December 18, 2008 4:23 PM

LOLZ i think i like Ryan :P

poor kid :\

MSA

Thursday, December 18, 2008 4:35 PM

yeah he's a great aide:)

To love someone is to see a miracle invisible to others.
--Francois Mauriac
It's fuzzy-minded liberal thinking like that that gets you eaten.

FREELANCERTEX

Thursday, December 18, 2008 9:58 PM

sounds like it ^_^

well of all the imponderables @_@ parties, snow, and stubborn friends never mix ><

MSA

Thursday, December 18, 2008 10:03 PM

huh??

To love someone is to see a miracle invisible to others.
--Francois Mauriac
It's fuzzy-minded liberal thinking like that that gets you eaten.

FREELANCERTEX

Thursday, December 18, 2008 10:48 PM

im in CT, one of my friends is at school in RI right nextdoor, and he wants to throw a post-semester/christmas party cuz he's gonna be out of state for my other friend's xmas party.

problem is, we're supposed to get sllllaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaammmed with snow tomorrow, but no ones willing to stay home or have it local, and the kid's not cancelling the party or moving it local (we're all from the same town btw, everyone whos going), and im supposed to be driving ppl, but ive driven on unplowed highways and dont like it. at all.

we've been talking for a while about it (online, i love AIM), and it looks like im gonna be driving ppl up tonight to miss the snow completely, and everyone else is coming tomorrow with a driver whos been driving in snow forfrickingever and is comfortable with it :P

NVGHOSTRIDER

Friday, December 19, 2008 12:07 AM

Snow? Honestly better you than me.

Sorry.

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The country is making a big mistake not teaching kids to cook and raise a garden and build fires.
-Loretta Lynn

CALIFORNIAKAYLEE

Friday, December 19, 2008 1:00 AM

How is it that some people who love a show as intelligent as Firefly can be so stupid? (See the "Revolution Firefly" thread if you're curious.) Sigh. I hate idiots.

Btw what happened to Zeek? He hasn't been around for like a week! Did he take off for vacation early?

I hate how everything slows down around holidays. No good shows on TV, friends are difficult to get ahold of, message boards are quiet, etc. Come on people, when work and school are out is the best time for leisure activities! Grumble grumble.

Blah, at least we leave for my parents place in less than a week. It's going to be the slowest week ever.

~CK

You can't take the sky from me...

MSA

Friday, December 19, 2008 1:46 AM

Hey CK:) HUGS

Yeah where is Zeek??

To love someone is to see a miracle invisible to others.
--Francois Mauriac
It's fuzzy-minded liberal thinking like that that gets you eaten.

ZEEK

Friday, December 19, 2008 5:30 AM

*appears* I'm alive! I did take vacation already. I had plenty saved up and ours is use it or lose it.

I was busy with the annual cleaning of the apartment and christmas shopping.

Today was wonderful. I stayed up late getting packed early. Woke up early hoping there would be room on an earlier flight and I could get on the standby list. There was supposed to be bad weather in chicago when my flight was supposed to get in tonight. I even called the day earlier trying to get moved to the earlier flight but they wanted $300. Anyway earlier flight over sold. My flight gets cancelled and they push me to a flight tomorrow. And think they're being so nice by waiving the change fee. ()*&@#@#@$@ why didn't you waive it yesterday!!?!?!

Anyway now I'm hoping my flight is on perfect time or I might miss the show my brother got us tickets for tomorrow night. Jerks!!

Looks like I missed a fun time in the previous thread. CK finally came out about her job huh? Or she's just throwing us off the trail of her top secret spy job.

Also I think NVG stumbled on a good idea in the previous thread. "The interwebs not just for pr0n anymore". My thinking is "why no?" World of Porncraft! We'll be rich!! CK can make the whole thing and just pay us royalties. :-P (I think I just made CK run and hide like she mentioned before)

MSA

Friday, December 19, 2008 12:51 PM

NVG here: Watched Futurama last night and there was mention of an "Olympic medal for sex". Why not World of Porncraft?

Besides, I think there needs to be more porn for couples out there. Shotty depictions of real sex is not real entertaining. If they can have reality TV then why not reality porn?

To love someone is to see a miracle invisible to others.
--Francois Mauriac
It's fuzzy-minded liberal thinking like that that gets you eaten.

MSA

Friday, December 19, 2008 3:36 PM

ok actually Ms.A here:)

HUGS Zeek honey I'm sorry and I will keep my fingers crossed on your flight

oooh real porn for couples nice

I would definitely be more interested in WoP than WoW

To love someone is to see a miracle invisible to others.
--Francois Mauriac
It's fuzzy-minded liberal thinking like that that gets you eaten.

COPILOT

Friday, December 19, 2008 7:50 PM

Hi guys! I have internet at home now! Woo me!
I'm trying to read enough to catch up now.
~Love

An I carried such a torch

MSA

Friday, December 19, 2008 8:14 PM

WHEEEEEEEEE!! Copilot so good to see you sweety!! How have you been ? How is everything?

To love someone is to see a miracle invisible to others.
--Francois Mauriac
It's fuzzy-minded liberal thinking like that that gets you eaten.

COPILOT

Friday, December 19, 2008 8:18 PM

All is well with me. Enjoying life even if it is really cold here now.

An I carried such a torch

NVGHOSTRIDER

Friday, December 19, 2008 9:06 PM

Awesome to see ya about.

Sucks. You get really hot weather in the summer and really cold weather in the winter.

I smell turkey cookin' in the kitchen.

MMMmmmmmmm....

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The country is making a big mistake not teaching kids to cook and raise a garden and build fires.
-Loretta Lynn

FUTUREMRSFILLION

Friday, December 19, 2008 9:17 PM

deep suckage, while most are enjoying a white run up to christmas, we are not enjoying mugginess and yuck with 70 degrees and 100% humidity

I am on The List. We are The Forsaken and we aim to burn!
"We don't fear the reaper"

FORSAKEN original

Trolls Against McCain

“I like your Christ, I do not like your Christians. Your Christians are so unlike your Christ.” Mahatma Gandhi

MSA

Friday, December 19, 2008 9:36 PM

HUGS FMF we're not muggy and 70 but the white...not so much. It's cold but the tiny sprinkle of snow is melting...sigh

HUGS Copilot that's good to hear!

Hmmm turkey..

To love someone is to see a miracle invisible to others.
--Francois Mauriac
It's fuzzy-minded liberal thinking like that that gets you eaten.

CALIFORNIAKAYLEE

Friday, December 19, 2008 9:49 PM

Quote:
Originally posted by Zeek:
Also I think NVG stumbled on a good idea in the previous thread. "The interwebs not just for pr0n anymore". My thinking is "why no?" World of Porncraft! We'll be rich!!

Lol, there are actually already a few out there (though not with the World of ____craft title -- there was a porn site called World of Whorecraft for awhile, with girls dressed up in vaguely WoWish costumes, and Blizzard sued them or something to make them change their name), at least three or four that I've heard of in passing. Google "Adult MMO" and several things pop up. And then there's always Second Life, the non-game online world with lots and lots of very weird sex stuff, and not much else.

~CK

You can't take the sky from me...

MSA

Saturday, December 20, 2008 1:00 PM

NVG in da hizzy!

Honestly, as natural as it is, I find most sex stuff to be a bit weird. Not the physical stuff, the psycho-social stuff. So many people are so infused with a multitude of factors for the sex they have that it is a big wonder how some people even procreate and others can't stop.

After this weeks discovery of the little girl in Florida and the the death of an 8 month old girl here in Churchill County I reinforce my view of mandatory sterilization of some people and/or painful and irrational disfigurement of the genitals of people who hurt kids.

Just trying to vent a little rage so's not to let that shit get to me. There tends to be that ugly place that tends to surface every so often. People forgot the old stories of monsters taking their children. Many people have become monsters with their complacency and neglect.

Questions: Does it make me a worse person to wish someone anally raped to death in prison? Is that one of those sexual issues I had previously mentioned? How can we put the fear back into people who don't take care of their kids?

To love someone is to see a miracle invisible to others.
--Francois Mauriac
It's fuzzy-minded liberal thinking like that that gets you eaten.

ZEEK

Saturday, December 20, 2008 7:52 PM

yay my flight got to Chicago. Granted AA was still incompetent enough to have our gate occupied when we landed and left us on the runway for a half hour before rolling up to the gate. What an annoying way to be late. Still we booked it to our show and made it. I don't know if you guys have heard of Second City, but it's basically Chicago's version of SNL. Best funny part was when they were doing these little scary visions of the future like "now back to the Sarah Palin show" and stuff. The good one though was "the Cubs are one strike away from winning the World Series" and then the narrator guy was like "think of the crazy shit that's about to go down in that game". Way too funny to Chicago people who just know the universe won't allow the Cubs to win the World Series.

Anyway I think we're about ready to head out to do some Christmas shopping. No time to check out those MMOP games yet.

MSA

Saturday, December 20, 2008 10:05 PM

Second City is awesome!! Oh have you seen Avenue Q yet??

Ok doing the happy dance of got my paycheck early and got a bonus:)

Glad you made it safe... and at least you weren't traveling on the masters of the lost luggage Delta...

To love someone is to see a miracle invisible to others.
--Francois Mauriac
It's fuzzy-minded liberal thinking like that that gets you eaten.

FREELANCERTEX

Sunday, December 21, 2008 4:57 AM

Ooooookay back from RI XD ^_^ that was fun. everyone ended up driving up thursday night, camped out all friday (except for a short excursion to walmart in the morning, then a friday night/saturday morning [wee hours] to Dennys) and started heading home at around noon today :P roads were awesomely clear, thank you road crew. aaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaah, good times ^_^

how's everyone's weekend been so far?

CHRISMOORHEAD

Sunday, December 21, 2008 5:49 AM

Heyooooooooooooo...

Who missed me?

[IMG]
Ride down from Asgard to the battlefield,
Bringer of the valiant dead who died but never yielded,
Carry we who die in battle over land and sea,
Across the rainbow bridge to Valhalla,
Odin's waiting for me.

MSA

Sunday, December 21, 2008 2:28 PM

NVG here:

Holy ferking shite!

Glad to see you are still kickin'.

Things good?

To love someone is to see a miracle invisible to others.
--Francois Mauriac
It's fuzzy-minded liberal thinking like that that gets you eaten.

MSA

Sunday, December 21, 2008 7:11 PM

Yeah me and my split personality...NV's just usually too tired to switch out to his own log in:)

HUGS Chris sweety how are you??

HUGS hey CK:)

OK *yawn* let's hear it for getting up super early on Sunday, goofing around, eating a yummy breakfast and then going back to sleep for a few hours.. Still a little fluff brained, but content.

Oh and as for pedophiles and others who hurt kids.. I vote castration with a rusty cheese grater and or whatever you did to the kid gets done to you!

To love someone is to see a miracle invisible to others.
--Francois Mauriac
It's fuzzy-minded liberal thinking like that that gets you eaten.

NVGHOSTRIDER

Monday, December 22, 2008 4:42 PM

Read TIRED and LAZY.

Good morning Ponderers.

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The country is making a big mistake not teaching kids to cook and raise a garden and build fires.
-Loretta Lynn

LEOPARDFLAN

Monday, December 22, 2008 6:28 PM

UNGROUNDED!!!!!!!

-does a very happy jig-

Aiko Kitahoshi, passenger aboard the LoS, frequently awol due to the phenomina that is rl.

NVGHOSTRIDER

Monday, December 22, 2008 9:23 PM

Yeesh. Slow day. MsA is off baking with a friend in Reno and I'm holding down the fort here at work. I am the only core stff here this week and have run of the roost.

Yay me.

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The country is making a big mistake not teaching kids to cook and raise a garden and build fires.
-Loretta Lynn

CHRISMOORHEAD

Tuesday, December 23, 2008 1:45 AM

My current situation is debatable, but I am happy, and I suppose that's what matters the most. I am married to a woman that I love very dearly... and I see I'm not the only recently wed person here? Or maybe I just have a faulty memory... too many concussions. Anyways, if I'm not mistaken, and if it's not too personal, may I ask how it came that NVG and MSA became man and wife?

[IMG]
Ride down from Asgard to the battlefield,
Bringer of the valiant dead who died but never yielded,
Carry we who die in battle over land and sea,
Across the rainbow bridge to Valhalla,
Odin's waiting for me.[/IMG]

MSA

Tuesday, December 23, 2008 1:57 AM

HUGS I Pm'd you sweety... but here let me tell you a little story.
MsG got a divorce from the MrG who had made her not so happy for a long time... then fast forward a few months. NVGhostrider offers to visit so MsB won't feel like a total loser on New Year's as a newly divorced with no where to go... they fall in love. MsB moves to Nevada and October 31st MsB becomes MsA. And they lived so so happily ever after

NOw... SQUEEEEEEEEEEEEEEE!!! HUGS this is wonderful news I am so happy for you!!! That is wonderful. You want to tell your story?
HUGS

To love someone is to see a miracle invisible to others.
--Francois Mauriac
It's fuzzy-minded liberal thinking like that that gets you eaten.

CHRISMOORHEAD

Tuesday, December 23, 2008 2:14 AM

Oh my bad, I actually changed my email a while back and just today updated my FFF.net profile to the new one, so I didn't get your PM. That's awesome about you and NVG, though, so many people use web forums and the internet in general to remain impersonal with people and maintain a comfortable distance from them, it's inspiring to hear people doing the opposite. I'm very happy for the both of you.

My wife was my first girlfriend I had back when I was 15 years old, and our less than cordial parting of ways was part of the reason I was such a misogamist (sp?). Well, after getting a second shot at military super-badassery, being a DOR (Dropped On Request), and feeling like a bitch because of it, I decided to give other things in life a shot. So for 3 months I turned my attention towards getting laid on a regular basis. My ex was on shaky grounds with her BF, and since he was the one she wound up with after me, I decided to play dirty pool and use her as one of my... "regulars". One month of this, love prevails, I say goodbye to my other lady friends, and elope with the new Mrs. Monica Moorhead (yeah, it doesn't sound good, but whatev).

For what it's worth, sorry if any of that was offensive... I had a lot of emotional growing up to do in a 3 month span.

Ride down from Asgard to the battlefield,
Bringer of the valiant dead who died but never yielded,
Carry we who die in battle over land and sea,
Across the rainbow bridge to Valhalla,
Odin's waiting for me.

NVGHOSTRIDER

Tuesday, December 23, 2008 4:25 AM

Alright hoss, that isn't dirty pool. That's just good tactics. Good for you. Kinda sounds a bit like our situation. Had to weed out the bullshit to get to the goods.

Oh, and MsA keeps bugging me about ducks or somesuch.

Kidding.

Keep your ass low and your head lower.

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The country is making a big mistake not teaching kids to cook and raise a garden and build fires.
-Loretta Lynn

FREELANCERTEX

Tuesday, December 23, 2008 5:10 AM

Quote:
Originally posted by LeopardFlan:
UNGROUNDED!!!!!!!

-does a very happy jig-

Aiko Kitahoshi, passenger aboard the LoS, frequently awol due to the phenomina that is rl.

YAAAAAAAAY RF!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! *does happy dance* ^_^

MSA

Tuesday, December 23, 2008 6:17 AM

not ducks I told him to tell you to DUCK and run and take cover ( yes I know you won't but still must say it. I really don't want you hurt)

Ok so sweet and wonderful that you managed to repair that relationship. I know that took a lot of risk and a serious leap of faith. I am so impressed. HUGS I think Monica is a lovely name and as long as you are happy I am thrilled for you

yay for the ungrounding... now did you bring your grades up?? HUGS

To love someone is to see a miracle invisible to others.
--Francois Mauriac
It's fuzzy-minded liberal thinking like that that gets you eaten.

MSA

Tuesday, December 23, 2008 4:32 PM

morning bump:)

To love someone is to see a miracle invisible to others.
--Francois Mauriac
It's fuzzy-minded liberal thinking like that that gets you eaten.

NVGHOSTRIDER

Tuesday, December 23, 2008 4:43 PM

Work. Yay.

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The country is making a big mistake not teaching kids to cook and raise a garden and build fires.
-Loretta Lynn

MSA

Tuesday, December 23, 2008 4:46 PM

NV

To love someone is to see a miracle invisible to others.
--Francois Mauriac
It's fuzzy-minded liberal thinking like that that gets you eaten.

LEOPARDFLAN

Tuesday, December 23, 2008 5:08 PM

Quote:
Originally posted by MsA:
yay for the ungrounding... now did you bring your grades up?? HUGS

Kinda- I managed to get my Spanish grade up to a solid B!!!! (this is a miracle, trust me- I SUCK at Spanish). My art grade slipped to a C though, since I didn't manage to complete a couple projects I was supposed to do... ah well. The rents wanted straight As before I got ungrounded, but that didn't happen, but they were nice and ungrounded me for break.

Aiko Kitahoshi, passenger aboard the LoS, frequently awol due to the phenomina that is rl.

MSA

Tuesday, December 23, 2008 5:16 PM

If you need some help sweety I would be happy to give you some tutoring:) HUGS

To love someone is to see a miracle invisible to others.
--Francois Mauriac
It's fuzzy-minded liberal thinking like that that gets you eaten.

GORRAMGROUPIE

Tuesday, December 23, 2008 5:38 PM

Howdy to this thread, already said HI otherwhere.

'Who are you and how did you get in here?' 'I'm a locksmith. And, I'm a locksmith.'
Police Squad

NVGHOSTRIDER

Tuesday, December 23, 2008 5:49 PM

Hola GG. Long time no see.

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The country is making a big mistake not teaching kids to cook and raise a garden and build fires.
-Loretta Lynn

MSA

Tuesday, December 23, 2008 6:29 PM

Hey Gorram

Hey we forgot a ponder... here's one. What new tradition are you starting this year?

NV and I are starting our Firefly ornament collection:)

To love someone is to see a miracle invisible to others.
--Francois Mauriac
It's fuzzy-minded liberal thinking like that that gets you eaten.

FREELANCERTEX

Tuesday, December 23, 2008 7:49 PM

I cn tutor espanol, RF!!!!!!!! ^_^ I r good at teh languages :P art is meh, its an elective right?

pretty much doin the same traditions here, MsA.

LEOPARDFLAN

Tuesday, December 23, 2008 8:32 PM

Not starting any traditions, just same old same old. Art is an elective but one that's really fun (i love art, even though i can't draw to save my life without a tiny little grid). I just got behind on a couple contract projects because of the stupid memory project (we have a semi-kinda exchange program, where people in the Advanced Art classes have to do portraits of these Ecuadorian orphans, and that took me forever!)

Aiko Kitahoshi, passenger aboard the LoS, frequently awol due to the phenomina that is rl.

FREELANCERTEX

Tuesday, December 23, 2008 9:32 PM

ever done pottery?

i cant do portraits or drawing to save my life >< building structures, pottery, designing, anything that requires construction or planning i can do. no pictures :P

NVGHOSTRIDER

Tuesday, December 23, 2008 10:10 PM

Other than the new stuff this year we get the day after Christmas off and have a previous tradition of hunting that day. This year we are headed east past Middlegate Station for bunnies. Hopefully the edible Cottontail sort.

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The country is making a big mistake not teaching kids to cook and raise a garden and build fires.
-Loretta Lynn

FREELANCERTEX

Wednesday, December 24, 2008 12:29 AM

never had rabbit. deer, yes, rabbit no. what do u usually do with em, cooking wise?

NVGHOSTRIDER

Wednesday, December 24, 2008 12:52 AM

Um, cook them...

They are like chicken. Prepare it to how you like. I prefer mine stewed with taters and the like. Sometimes baked in the oven.

MMmmmm....

So I have started my campaign against the arrogant decoy maker from the show we recently attended. I've contacted the local paper via e-mail detailing the misinformation and the liability of their lack of fact finding. The writer even admitted to have lived in the valley her whole life and knew better.

How does the government continue to protect people in the media who do this? This isn't Brittney Spears' baby daddy drama and what she is wearing to the Grammys. This is dying history that some people persue for financial gain and social notoriety at the cost of the spirit and tradition of a dying people.

I am doing my very best not to misdirect my anger. But it gets harder and harder to excuse people who know better.

xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
The country is making a big mistake not teaching kids to cook and raise a garden and build fires.
-Loretta Lynn

FREELANCERTEX

Wednesday, December 24, 2008 12:56 AM

cool. sounds tasty lol.

what happened to the decoy maker? or..what did he do...?

MSA

Wednesday, December 24, 2008 1:11 AM

basically he learned how to make them from a book ( completely ignoring the traditional makers and the way the craft is handed down from a teacher to student within the tribe) and then he began to promote himself as the guy who revived a lost art. He made claims in the paper that he had to learn that way because no one was around to teach him ( a total lie as NV has been making them exactly as he learned from his uncle and exactly as the skill has been passed down for generations.. verified by tribal elders)
He promotes himself all the time and even through his publicity won the governors award. He acts like he's this huge big shot and has been teaching non natives how to make a native craft ( illegal) and they have been selling them... again illegal, Plus totally disrespectful to the true artists who have carried this tradition for generations and who are humble. This guy's such an absolute ass!!!!

To love someone is to see a miracle invisible to others.
--Francois Mauriac
It's fuzzy-minded liberal thinking like that that gets you eaten.

LEOPARDFLAN

Wednesday, December 24, 2008 1:11 AM

Quote:
Originally posted by freelancertex:
ever done pottery?

i cant do portraits or drawing to save my life >< building structures, pottery, designing, anything that requires construction or planning i can do. no pictures :P

I can't really do anything with actual drawing either- it takes me forever and I'm not real good at it. But I am good at abstract stuff, with lots and lots of colours ^_^

As for pottery, I can manage pretty well by hand, but I can't throw on the wheel to save my life lolz. My fav part of pottery is going the glazes, though, they're so pretty ^_^

Aiko Kitahoshi, passenger aboard the LoS, frequently awol due to the phenomina that is rl.

FREELANCERTEX

Wednesday, December 24, 2008 1:15 AM

ooh, pottery on the wheel is the only pottery i can do :P easier to form though its rough on the hands ><

Quote:
Originally posted by MsA: basically he learned how to make them from a book ( completely ignoring the traditional makers and the way the craft is handed down from a teacher to student within the tribe) and then he began to promote himself as the guy who revived a lost art. He made claims in the paper that he had to learn that way because no one was around to teach him ( a total lie as NV has been making them exactly as he learned from his uncle and exactly as the skill has been passed down for generations.. verified by tribal elders)
He promotes himself all the time and even through his publicity won the governors award. He acts like he's this huge big shot and has been teaching non natives how to make a native craft ( illegal) and they have been selling them... again illegal, Plus totally disrespectful to the true artists who have carried this tradition for generations and who are humble. This guy's such an absolute ass!!!!

*blinks*

*shuts mouth*

don't be kind to him, NV

what a dumbass @_@

NVGHOSTRIDER

Wednesday, December 24, 2008 1:33 AM

http://www.lahontanvalleynews.com/article/20080309/NEWS/102393790&pare
ntprofile=search

I've known him for quite a while. His unethical pursuit of decoy making, misrepresentation, self promotion, and disrespect toward the show we recently attended has prompted me to make a move against him. I actually supported his efforts until recent events pulled the wrong string. I did some digging and confirmed some rumors about him. Things like teaching non-natives (not just demonstrating), calling his craft a "traditional art" despite never having learned the actual traditional way to make them, and disrespecting the people who work so hard every year at the show. I would love to greatly discount the value of his work as it is not true traditional and can be valued equally as one would value a Chinese, Indian (from India), or Mexican reproduction. Yeah, he's a Native American. But that's like having some random English person making a piece of expensive looking furniture and claiming it's a traditional piece of English furniture that takes an apprenticeship and years of work before even being capable of placing their makers mark on the piece. His knowledge did not decend from previous makers making, his piece purely decor. Some justice must be served or his actions will destroy tradition and honor of the previous makers. This is not an easy task. He already has ignorant people with a lot of money on his side. Luckily I have history and tradition on mine. Too bad history and tradition mean little to society these days.

https://www.leg.state.nv.us/68th/95bills/ACR30_EN.TXT
I am named on this Resolution from the State Of Nevada in 1995. It is noted by them that there is a mistake. Jimmy and Wuzzie George are not my grandparents. That was a cultural miscommunication made by one of the representatives. The State has it on file that I have decended from their people and I have learned from their grandson, Martin George. Some uppety woman wanted to see my verification of being a traditional maker. Verification comes from elders, other makers, and demonstration of that craft. I have all of that. But such things aren't traditionally something verified on paper. This reolution and perhaps a resolution from the Tribal Council may be all the verification I will ever need.

Wow. I'm being a real nice guy over this. There are many other avenues I considered. This is the most acceptable.

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The country is making a big mistake not teaching kids to cook and raise a garden and build fires.
-Loretta Lynn

LEOPARDFLAN

Wednesday, December 24, 2008 1:47 AM

Holy. Fucking. Crap.

Aiko Kitahoshi, passenger aboard the LoS, frequently awol due to the phenomina that is rl.

FREELANCERTEX

Wednesday, December 24, 2008 2:39 AM

huh. so thats the guy? dumbass. *agrees with RF*

MSA

Wednesday, December 24, 2008 6:42 AM

Yeah it has taken everything I have not to just kill the evil stupid ass... here we have the most incredible native artist ( NV) who works so hard to maintain the craft of his people ( a people who were set upon and decimated by the whites) and he persists in maintaining this tribal craft of decoy making which dates back more than a thousand centuries, He's done so much and yet this worthless ass has taken all the credit...so angry.
How dare he. ok trying so hard to be calm and zen...

ChrisMoorehead sweety if you have a minute..would you mind terribly shredding them slowly and painfully? Thanks :) HUGS

I am trying really hard to just let it go, but I am so angry that the asshole would take a centuries old tradition and co-opt it for his personal monetary gain

To love someone is to see a miracle invisible to others.
--Francois Mauriac
It's fuzzy-minded liberal thinking like that that gets you eaten.

MSA

Wednesday, December 24, 2008 1:43 PM

NVG here, 5AM:

It really sucks. We are down to exposure, popularity, and media coverage. Small things really as related to the actual issues, but like many things in the modern world they seem to matter more than the truth. With the right exposure, friends, and media coverage a person can easily manipulate the truth to their benefit. People who backed him (especially the ones with money) would hate to admit being on the wrong side and probably never will. Like I said, if they knew the actual value of his pieces they will be pissed. His work is incredible, but he surely is on par with people not of our persuasion in terms of spirit and credibility.

I did have a great idea. It may blow up in my face as people are easily persuaded in terms of notoriety and greed.

I may present a resolution before the tribal council aimed toward preservation of tribal arts and traditions. With so few people left to verify true artisans it may be a difficult sell, but I believe in the good intentions I based the idea on.

One of the people supporting me has encouraged me to weed out the charlatans and to continue on the way I have been on. Apparently more exposure on my part is not a bad thing.

Comparison:

It is difficult to compare work, value, and price without sounding like a complete dick. But the truth is this:

He is not traditionally trained. He is self taught and did a ton of research, which is commendable, but not acceptable to define as traditional artist. The training I received was the classic apprenticeship tale: braving mud and mosquito, ice and wind, working to all hours of the night just to finish a piece exactly as taught. My first acceptable piece was not ready until ten months after the beginning of my training. Even then it was over a year before I was able to complete a piece and apply my mark. Some of my mentors work has elements of my own work attached. It is impossible for me to find those pieces as the value of his work has prompted people to lock them away.

There has been instances where he has taught non-natives how to construct decoys. Literally. And for money. Now, I've seen people demonstrate before allowing observers to try making one themselves. This seems an acceptable practice within limitations. He has clearly gone beyond those limits as a few of those people have made their own and sold them for decor (which is the true value of his work). It can be understood that he puts a considerable amount of time into his work. But the materials are free, he doesn't work so he has plenty of time, and the art he pursues is a dead art with no people left to consult as to it's actual construction and spirit. He has devalued his own pieces and made a profit. That is on the edge of being evil as it has devalued the previous makers to which he has no relation. People have bought into that and have been misdirected by him. This is not much different than using magic to hurt people. It is wrong and must be accounted for.

When I sell a piece or demonstrate it all has a base rate: 30 dollars an hour for decoy work, 60 a day for demonstration, free to consult on matters related to the work, work of previous makers, and pondering on native art. I don't charge the tribe when they ask me to work with the kids during the summer recreation program. I take the afternoon off as not to be paid for that time. They do offer a stipend to cover my fuel for collection of material and lunch. It has been told to me by several people that others (including Mr Williams) have charged a few hundred dollars a day. Why do this? it totally devalues the work of both the artist and the children.

To love someone is to see a miracle invisible to others.
--Francois Mauriac
It's fuzzy-minded liberal thinking like that that gets you eaten.

MSA

Wednesday, December 24, 2008 2:17 PM

Continued:

The guide lines I was sworn to follow:
Never work while drinking. My mentor was an alcoholic and hated himself for doing so. He had too many emotional issues that seemed to get in the way of his work excelling. He didn't want those limits to hinder me.
Learn to speak and write well. His grandparents had problems relating to the people studying them Though certain concepts are lost in translation, the spirit of those things can be sealed in the words we say and write.
Never teach non-natives and consider only teaching people of the Stillwater Marsh. Any sweatshop can set up a decoy production and pass them off as Native art. Though there are now laws protecting the true traditional arts, there will always be some people looking for more money rather than applying the true concept of the art; survival.
Keep your prices as low as possible. It allows everyone a chance to buy a piece and gives the maker much needed practice. The true value of the decoys is utility, not aesthetics.

To this I have to add: Embrace confrontation. Demonstration of the work speaks for itself. There will always be people trying to discount a makers work and credibility. A true maker has nothing to hide and is open with the people who question them. This is a primitive concept usually not requiring translation or explanation. After being told stories of people watching me work and noting to others that the way I work is how it has been done before me is a huge honor. Having been over a year since I first heard this I am still in a state of shock. For me there is no greater praise than hearing that I do the work and I do it correctly.

The final form of the decoy is this:
http://contentdm.library.unr.edu/cdm4/item_viewer.php?CISOROOT=/spphot
os&CISOPTR=498&CISOBOX=1&REC=1

I have never had the courage to make one until now. They are the tule body with an actual duck skin stretched over it. The ultimate decoy, it is responsible for the survival of the Stillwater people. I think this may be the time to make them. People outside of museums have never seen them.

I think some people question my intentions. But few people understand the weight people like me carry. Ancient ways being exploited, on the edge of death...

Naw, there's no reason to be so fired up and passionate.

Thanks for reading folks. It is almost 6:30Am and I just needed to purge some info. I also didn't feel like writing all this down just to lose it later.

Merry Christmas

To love someone is to see a miracle invisible to others.
--Francois Mauriac
It's fuzzy-minded liberal thinking like that that gets you eaten.

FREELANCERTEX

Wednesday, December 24, 2008 4:32 PM

that was a very CK-esque post ;) and I think you have a very valid point. that guy seems more lame by the second ><

that decoy's amazing btw.

MSA

Wednesday, December 24, 2008 4:57 PM

MsA here...
Well said NV
You really should see him demonstrate. It's amazing to watch

To love someone is to see a miracle invisible to others.
--Francois Mauriac
It's fuzzy-minded liberal thinking like that that gets you eaten.

FREELANCERTEX

Wednesday, December 24, 2008 5:36 PM

i'd love to see him demonstrate. i love building/constructing/making things, so i'd probably be like hovering over his shoulder annoyingly just *staring* O_O without blinking until he was done XD (is a fan of the "how its made" show on Discovery ;) )

NVGHOSTRIDER

Wednesday, December 24, 2008 11:59 PM

Check out Obama-Guns at RWED. I felt in the giving mood and issued a reply not becoming a gentleman.

Oops. My bad.

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The country is making a big mistake not teaching kids to cook and raise a garden and build fires.
-Loretta Lynn

GORRAMGROUPIE

Thursday, December 25, 2008 12:34 AM

Me too FLT!

NVG, I hope you can impress on this guy how what he is doing impacts others.
It's like the commercials for the rolling heater, made by the "Amish", yet in the commercial they show tools and techniques that true Amish wouldn't use (ie nail gun), trying to capitalize on the reputation the Amish have. It does devalue and trivialize the true craftsperson.

'Who are you and how did you get in here?' 'I'm a locksmith. And, I'm a locksmith.'
Police Squad

CHRISMOORHEAD

Thursday, December 25, 2008 2:37 AM

NVG, MSA, Thank you both for your concern. Right now, though, things are taking a dramatically different direction for me. I can't go into it, but I appriciate your thoughts.

That is a hell of a thing about the duck maker. I don't want to take the spotlight off of your plight, but people do this stuff all the time to promote their BS. There's a guy named Tom Brown... I don't like to sling mud, especially since I don't have any proof, but he claims he teaches tracking based off of the teachings from a friend's Native American grandfather. Thing is I've heard inconsistencies in his re-telling of certain stories. Nevermind the number of "authentic" edged weapons out there, or "Ninja Grandmasters". People have been shamming for a long time, and in my opinion the capitalist trade system promotes pretenders to the throne.

I am sorry that your culture is being shamed by this guy, especially since he appears to be of the same blood. Hopefully he will be exposed for what he is.

Happy Holidays, by the way.

Ride down from Asgard to the battlefield,
Bringer of the valiant dead who died but never yielded,
Carry we who die in battle over land and sea,
Across the rainbow bridge to Valhalla,
Odin's waiting for me.

NVGHOSTRIDER

Thursday, December 25, 2008 2:52 AM

It continues, the expolitation. But as long as people are willing to pass on truth and tradition there is still a chance with most things.

My favorite is Mall Ninjas and their expertise with weapons and tactic. Pure cheese, very fatty and dangerous in excess.

Have a good one.

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The country is making a big mistake not teaching kids to cook and raise a garden and build fires.
-Loretta Lynn

FREELANCERTEX

Thursday, December 25, 2008 2:54 AM

Quote:
Originally posted by NVGhostRider: (from RWED) First off, "The People" are armed to keep the government from ruling with jack boots much the way the founding fathers fought the monarchy of England

thaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaank yoooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooou ^_^ loved ur post btw.

NVGHOSTRIDER

Thursday, December 25, 2008 5:08 AM

It's not all glomour and fame...
Apparently according to one of the posters I am a troll and deserve the childish passive aggressive responses to their circle jerky posts.

So I called him a doody head and gave up for the night. Feel like I fed into it. Actually apologized for a less than civil post and it was pretty much ignored and insulted further.

Oh well. Little mans syndrome sucks.

We are watching my kids from work beat the crap out of eachother with DDR. I think a new word for that need to be created.

How about:
Revalutarific!

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The country is making a big mistake not teaching kids to cook and raise a garden and build fires.
-Loretta Lynn

FREELANCERTEX

Thursday, December 25, 2008 10:28 PM

lolz, they just don't like that you're disagreeing with them @_@ people are touchy about that sort of thing.

lolz, revolutarific? XD awesome

MSA

Friday, December 26, 2008 1:16 AM

Ah the perfect Christmas.. a whole day with nothing to do but enjoy.. had mimosas and snacks all day. I relaxed and enjoyed my books and NV has been playing Wii. This day ROCKS!!! Best Christmas ever:) Oh and this morning when we got up it was snowing beautifully. Then it stopped so roads are nice and clear

To love someone is to see a miracle invisible to others.
--Francois Mauriac
It's fuzzy-minded liberal thinking like that that gets you eaten.

MSA

Friday, December 26, 2008 3:34 PM

morning all.... so tired, but yesterday was really nice

How has everyone's holiday been?

To love someone is to see a miracle invisible to others.
--Francois Mauriac
It's fuzzy-minded liberal thinking like that that gets you eaten.

GORRAMGROUPIE

Friday, December 26, 2008 5:22 PM

Holiday was great, other than having to work, but at least I work from home, so I was around to interact at least. We have a ton of snow to shovel at work, but it sure looks nice out.

'Who are you and how did you get in here?' 'I'm a locksmith. And, I'm a locksmith.'
Police Squad

MSA

Friday, December 26, 2008 6:40 PM

HUGS that's great Gorram

To love someone is to see a miracle invisible to others.
--Francois Mauriac
It's fuzzy-minded liberal thinking like that that gets you eaten.

AG05

Saturday, December 27, 2008 12:13 AM

Well, that was a fun holiday, the first I've spent with family in a coupla years. The fact that I've been back living with my parents (gorram ruttin' hurricanes) made it a bit less special and a bit more "Please let me come back to work, I'm gong nuts!!" I picked up a few revolver accessories for my dad, jewelry for mom, and money for my sisters iPod-replacement fund.

I was well pleased with my Christmas goodie haul as well I got Firefly on DVD, a few rifle bits, and a new Safariland holster.

I did, however make the mistake of telling 3 people that I wanted a brown coat (guess why?) for Christmas. I was not really expecting to get one. Instead, I am now the proud owner of 2 brown Carhartt jackets and, courtesy of a buddy who likes Wild West/Single Action shooting, a dark brown, ankle length duster. So I'm an all-weather browncoat now. Life is good.

Hope everybody had a lovely holiday, and I hope everyone recovers enough to go back to work Monday.

Mercy is the mark of a great man.
Guess I'm just a good man.
Well, I'm alright.

MSA

Saturday, December 27, 2008 12:33 AM

Sounds like a great Christmas for you:) That's fab:)

To love someone is to see a miracle invisible to others.
--Francois Mauriac
It's fuzzy-minded liberal thinking like that that gets you eaten.

NVGHOSTRIDER

Saturday, December 27, 2008 3:03 PM

There is a quick draw group in the next town. Gonna get in good with them in the near future, Awesome fun!

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The country is making a big mistake not teaching kids to cook and raise a garden and build fires.
-Loretta Lynn

MSA

Saturday, December 27, 2008 10:00 PM

Not today... you're sick ( NV has a terrible sinus infection and cough...)

To love someone is to see a miracle invisible to others.
--Francois Mauriac
It's fuzzy-minded liberal thinking like that that gets you eaten.

VERSEEXPLORER

Sunday, December 28, 2008 2:36 AM

Quote:
Originally posted by MsA:
Not today... you're sick ( NV has a terrible sinus infection and cough...)

I know you are taking good care of him. I hope he feels better soon.

Chrismoorhead, congratulations on getting married. Best wishes in the future.

FREELANCERTEX

Sunday, December 28, 2008 3:56 AM

pheeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeew. ok, i just reformatted my comp (those of u who have visited the bar will know why) and mcafee's bein a bitch and not letting me reinstall it, but i have spybot which is an antispyware/malware program. the ponder I have for all of you is: what antivirus/firewall/security program can i download so I can protect my comp?

*doesnt have the money to re-up mcafee, as they want 70 bucks for a year*

MSA

Sunday, December 28, 2008 8:35 PM

Not a clue FLT I have a MacBook... we're not the same as you PC people...giggle HUGS and I hope you get your comp fixed:)

HUGS Hi Vex... yeah I am fussing over him and fixing him food and giving backrubs and such...( which is what he does when I'm sick)

To love someone is to see a miracle invisible to others.
--Francois Mauriac
It's fuzzy-minded liberal thinking like that that gets you eaten.

FREELANCERTEX

Monday, December 29, 2008 1:23 AM

nvm i got the other stuff to work by uninstalling mcafee ^_^ i hate paid subscriptions @_@

MSA

Monday, December 29, 2008 6:01 PM

NVG Here:

You hate paid subscriptions?
Even your subscriptions to Tarts and Juggs?

To love someone is to see a miracle invisible to others.
--Francois Mauriac
It's fuzzy-minded liberal thinking like that that gets you eaten.

KELKHIL

Monday, December 29, 2008 6:10 PM

FLT - I use AVG

http://free.avg.com/

Just follow the "free" version links to download it.

I refuse to pay for anti-virus stuff (especially since i think they pay hackers to write stuff to keep them in business)

I have never caught a virus with AVG.

Also food for thought..... Does your Windows account allow for multiple log ins? If so create one that does not have Admin Privs and use that one for normal use. That way the only way stuff can be installed is by either logging in to the Admin Account or with an Admin Password on your normal use account. Save you from catching most viruses normally.

Hope this helps!

FREELANCERTEX

Monday, December 29, 2008 6:37 PM

SQUEEEEEEEEEEEEEEE!!!!!!!!!!!!! *running-glomps Kel* UR BACK!!!!

yeah i was trying to load AVG but for some reason it wouldn't let me, which is why i posted said question >< played around with settings and installers for a bit and finally got AVG to work.

I'm with you, i refuse to pay for antivirus protection @_@

NV: ha. ha.

MSA

Monday, December 29, 2008 10:46 PM

yeah he is , on occasion hilarious

OK back to sick time

To love someone is to see a miracle invisible to others.
--Francois Mauriac
It's fuzzy-minded liberal thinking like that that gets you eaten.

FREELANCERTEX

Tuesday, December 30, 2008 3:04 PM

lol nice one.

MSA

Tuesday, December 30, 2008 8:09 PM

ok we're gonna need a new thread soon...haven't the energy to do it right now...maybe later

To love someone is to see a miracle invisible to others.
--Francois Mauriac
It's fuzzy-minded liberal thinking like that that gets you eaten.

FREELANCERTEX

Tuesday, December 30, 2008 9:11 PM

Aw. How's NV doin btw?

Here's an imponder: why the hell won't software that works for everyone else on the globe work on my computer?

MSA

Tuesday, December 30, 2008 10:20 PM

He's finally starting to seem a tiny bit better...still bad cough and snuffles but the fever is finally going down. My snuffles remain annoying

Because FLT you have the evil Vista... get a Mac...come on you know you want o

To love someone is to see a miracle invisible to others.
--Francois Mauriac
It's fuzzy-minded liberal thinking like that that gets you eaten.

FREELANCERTEX

Wednesday, December 31, 2008 3:16 AM

i dont have vista i have XP :D and i *hate* Macs. besides this software is for microsoft products, so theres no reason it shouldnt work lolz, cept that it doesnt like me apparently XD

ha. i laugh at the ness.

i'm bored. ><

MSA

Wednesday, December 31, 2008 1:31 PM

NVG here:

New Thread:
http://www.fireflyfans.net/mthread.asp?b=2&t=36218

To love someone is to see a miracle invisible to others.
--Francois Mauriac
It's fuzzy-minded liberal thinking like that that gets you eaten.